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Originally Posted by lakedude
Bob I couldn't help but notice that you left my car out of your discussion.
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Correct. In engineering, we like to keep as many items constant as possible and limit the variations to just one. I would have no problem with comparing the manual transmission Honda Civic to the two Honda CVT models:
City:
48 mpg - Civic I CVT
46 mpg - Civic I MT
49 mpg - Civic II CVT
Highway:
47 mpg - Civic I CVT
51 mpg - Civic I MT
51 mpg - Civic II CVT
When the Prius manual transmission comes out, I look forward to comparing it to the Civic manual transmission (don't hold your breath.)
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Originally Posted by lakedude
If you look at our database you will see that Toyota's EPA figures are inflated much higher than Honda's. . . .
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The EPA figures comes from the exact same driving profile for each car. The GH database is useful for showing what a set of users are reporting and their differences with the EPA MPG simply restates the obvious . . . the EPA protocol needs to be updated. Until then, the EPA protocol is the only controlled, engineering reproducable data we have.
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Originally Posted by lakedude
The Insights (MT followed by the CVT at a distant second) and manual tranny Civic take the top 3 mpg spots. All the Honda's are getting very close to their EPA ratings. The Toyota's are not even close! Using EPA City (instead of a combined figure) is even more misleading.
According to EPA city the Prius2 gets 60mpg but in real life the Prius2 only gets 47.5mpg, a 26% exaggeration!
By comparison my car is rated 46mpg City but in real life gets 48.3, a full 5% more than EPA city.
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I guess I'm confused by your signature, "61.8". Did I miss something? How did you measure "48.3"? Is that from just the online display?
The reason I ask is the last two weeks and three fill-ups, my Prius I is showing a range of 52-80+ mpg on my daily commute and that includes 1 out of 10 miles at highway speeds. The weekly numbers are: 57.7, 63.9 and 54.2 mpg. My weekend, highway numbers are: 62.4, 54.3 and 50.5 mpg measured at the pump.
Here is
my commute route. What is yours?
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Originally Posted by lakedude
The Prius is a fantastic car but it does not walk on water and it does not get 60 mpg in the hands of most drivers.
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Good thing we don't use the combined MPG but just the City EPA number, right?
As for EPA numbers, I'm getting better than EPA with my NHW11, Prius I after my first 6 months, the winter months. I understand it may get better, we'll see. My combined MPG is coming in about 4.4%
more than the EPA combined. But I notice you are #3 in the Honda Civic MT list and I'm only #5 in the Prius I list.
Bob Wilson