I can add. I did the arithmetic and the Prius won't break even vs say a Honda Fit. The Prius will get maybe 40 mpg lifetime(100,000 miles), the Fit maybe 28mpg. The 1100 or so gallons saved wil be ~$4000. An hour ago ,I paid $26000($23,700+TTL) out the door for a Pk 4 Prius. I could get the Fit sport-automatic trans+ cruise control for $18000 out the door.I'll never make up the $5000 difference(after $3100 credit). However, I still happy about it. I just like the high tech aspect of Prius. It also can carry 2 adults and two long legged greyhounds-an absolute necessity since we travel with the mutts. The Fit is pretty roomy for such a tiny-155" vehicle, but the extra size and wt of the Prius might give it a slight crash advantage, and a slight ride advantage.
Oh well,Charlie

 

The Prius II was introduced in 2004, so it might be premature to talk about lifetime fuel mileage. We can't yet gauge the effects of time, on the car. However, we can isolate some of the cars with the most miles driven. Let's look at the eight cars, in the GH database, with over 40K miles, as of 4/13/06.

Miles Mileage
50481 57.4
46297 56.1
43248 55.5
41064 52.5
52318 50.9
50311 50.2
44568 47.8
51488 45.4

That comes out to a total of 379775 miles at an average 51.9 MPG. That's like driving to the moon and half-way back. It's like driving around the equator of Earth, 15 1/2 times. That's a lot of miles.

Run your numbers again, with 51.9MPG and see what happens.

 

Ahh, but that's where you can influence whether or not your investment pays off. 40mpg is a very lowball estimate for a Prius unless you only drive 3 miles at a time on a cold engine. The average in the database here is 48mpg and many people have been able to achieve a lifetime average far above that. It takes some effort and the choice is yours as to whether or not that's your cup of tea. HSD is a beautiful system with lots of room to play if fuel economy is your game! If only I had the money...

Congrats on your purchase!

 

True, 40 mpg is a lowside estimate. Comparing it to a Fit probably isn't appropriate either, but there really aren't a lot of hatchbacks out there.
I think there is a Focus hatchback. CR numbers on it were something like 17/33 vs 35/51 for the Prius. The XB Scion is a bit smaller and not available with side side curtain airbags.It's CR numbers are 23/37.There is no way I would buy a tiny vehicle and pay $17000 and not get side curtains(folks around here-New Orleans-run redlights by 3-5 seconds).The Matrix is probably the closest in size, interior room and performance.CR shows 17/33 for it(EPA is 28/34 I think).A Matrix with side curtains will MSRP~$20,000, so it might be sold for $18,500+TTL or $20,000 OTD. It would deliver maybe 22 mpg lifetime.We do a lot of city-stoplight to stoplight driving. My wife and son get CR numbers in their city driving.They don't drive fast, but they never coast-they always have their foot on some control-gas or brake-never on the floorboards. This is why I use such low numbers.
The Matrix 22MPG vs the Prius 40 over 100,000 miles is 2045 gallons.At $3/gal it would break even at 50,000 miles.At $6/gal (not impossible, but a grim thought) break even would be 25000 miles.
Compared to a Camry which CR got 16/34 it would break even quickly.We would get maybe 18 mpg with a Camry in city driving.It would use 3055 more gallons in 100,000 miles.Now a 2007 LE Camry would cost $22000 OTD.At $3/gal breakeven is about 10,000 miles.
The Matrix is probably the best comparison, and it reaches breakeven at 50,000 miles-thanks to the tax credit-it would still reach break even during the time I would own it- without the credit BE~100,000 miles.I will put 200,000 miles on it.
The main reason we need a hatchback(ruled out the Civic Hybrid) is because we drive to Flagstaff AZ and stay at a La Quinta for a week every summer.The change in climate is really nice, and I get to ride my MTB in real mountains. We bring our dog-Phoebe-and she is fairly tall and leggy.We will probably have another dog soon,so the vehicle had to be two greyhound capable.Phoebe tested the Prius-she fits fine.She has to keep her head down a little, but there is plenty of sleeping room especially when I stretch a length of plywood across the gap between the front seats and the tops of the back seats.The headrests act as supports, and I'll also attach it to the center console. It adds another 10 inches of useful sleeping room to the back. I glue dense foam to the plywood to bring it level with the seat backs.
We have use the Honda Pilot in the past, but we might use the Prius this time. I wonder how good a trip vehicle something as small as a Prius is?The trip is 1500 miles one way.
The Prius is actually replacing my Titan. It would get about 12 mpg in pure city driving. At 16 mpg(reasonable average mpg) it would use 3750 more gallons over 100,000 miles.I paid $6850 more for the Prius than the Titan sold for, but I'll still reach breakeven at 60,000 miles at $3/gal. Besides my wife hated driving the Titan, she loves driving the Prius.
Oh well, I have run on. Everyone can rest easy,;since I bought a Prius gas will drop to $2/gal soon. Thanks,Charlie
PS Has anyone added aftermarket HIDs??

 

Don't believe the Consumer Reports numbers on hybrids. There are lots of threads here about inaccurate their numbers are.

They've got some kind of issue with hybrids. Their tests numbers for both the Prius and HCH are so low, it's unexplainable. Real databases, like the one here, are much more accurate.

We all hope gas drops to the bargain price of $2/gallon.

 

No kidding. I was sent an *Sigh* newspaper article about hybrids from my grandfather, about how the Ford Escape Hybrid gets 22 MPG and the Prius gets 35 MPG...

 

Hi Charlie,
Just a quick reminder, update your profile and please put that puppy in the database. When you do the plywood mod, make photos to share. I'm looking forward to your performance reports.

Bob Wilson

 

Yes, I agreed that CR's city loop must be a very rugged loop. With regular ICE vehicles my son and wife get city numbers much like CR's numbers. I can usually beat CR'sand my wife and son's city numbers by 10-15%. I did a quick check on the Prius-it delivers good numbers. I drive to a gum to swim; it is about 2.6 miles from home. With the vehicles cold-12 hrs since run- and with the ambients temp the same~75 degrees this is what I get for that short trip via Scanguage and onboard Prius guage for the 2.6 mile trip.
Tundra V-8 13 mpg
Titan 11.9 mpg
Prizm 26 mpg
Pilot 16 mpg
Prius 43 mpg
This is trying to max out mpg on the top 4 vehicles. With the Prius, I just drove with the AC blasting, and no special effort. I'm not really tuned to max mpg with the Prius. In some situations I suspect it is better to use a little brake while gliding up to a stop. With the other vehicles, I avoid braking. If I don't brake a little with the Prius, I don't see any energy going to the battery. If I do all the braking at the end with the Prius, it only recharges for a couple of seconds.It doesn't tell me if those couple of seconds are as "good' as 5 seconds od more gently braking?
From a dead stop-dead cold- it is 17 mpg better-will travel 65% farther-than the very efficient Prizm.It is maybe 200 lbs heavier than the Prizm, and has a lot more interior room.
Bob, I'll make sure I pt my data in the MPG base. I'll put some pictures of the plywood-foam "extender' once I make it.Pretty straighforward. It wouldn't be suitable for an adult human to kneel on, but it is easily up to a 75 lb dog putting 1-2 feet on it occasionally. Thanks,Charlie

 

The Prius has never pretended to be the cheapest new car you can buy; obviously a $13k car is loads cheaper, especially because cars like that often get very good FE too. But even a fuel-efficient $13k car is more expensive than a used car, or whatever your current car is... if you currently have a 25 mpg car, and you want to buy a Prius that gets 50 mpg, and you drive 15k miles a year, it would take 26 years to make up the $22k you paid for the Prius (neglecting the value you got back for your trade-in, or the tax credit, but also ignoring tax).

Nobody buys new cars to save money so I don't understand why this is an issue.

BTW, the Honda Fit sounds like an excellent car.

 

Also, gas prices are only going up. Before the end of the Prius's lifespan, figure gas will hit $5 a gallon. All those Chinese will only keep using more oil. That can favor the Prius in the long run.