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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2005, 10:13 PM
AZCivic AZCivic is offline
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Real Name: Brandon
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Hybrids: 1997 Civic HX
Posts: 878
Default Re: can someone educate me on hybrid cars compare to diesel engine cars???

To be fair, the prevous generation Jetta TDI was far less expensive than an Accord Hybrid. I'm not sure about pricing on the new one since it's much closer in interior volume to the Accord, but it's still likely thousands cheaper in a typical price configuration. Most Jettas seem to price out in the $25-26k range very well equipped.

Sure, it will still be slower, even chipped, but I drove a Golf 1.8T cross-country and thought it was an extremely pleasant car. The Jetta TDI fills a nice spot higher in price and faster (when chipped) than a Prius or Civic Hybrid, but lower in price and speed than the Accord Hybrid. It's really sad that they sell 130-165hp versions of the TDI in Europe but never offered those versions of the engine here, leaving it up to the owner to do some aftermarket modifications to reach that same power level.

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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 12-03-2005, 11:36 PM
seftonm seftonm is offline
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Real Name: Mike
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Hybrids: None
Posts: 8
Default Re: can someone educate me on hybrid cars compare to diesel engine cars???

We will probably see a lot more diesel cars being sold here once ULSD becomes the norm. Unfortunately, the phase-in period is quite long (4 years or so) if I remember correctly. Our assortment of weak European diesels doesn't seem to be helping the current perception in North America. Lots of people I talk to seem to think that 100 hp is about all a 1.9 TDI is capable of because that's all we see here. It's too bad they don't have much of an idea what's going on on the other side of the Atlantic.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2005, 12:48 AM
AZCivic AZCivic is offline
Conservative Socialist
 
Real Name: Brandon
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Hybrids: 1997 Civic HX
Posts: 878
Default Re: can someone educate me on hybrid cars compare to diesel engine cars???

No, the EPA has mandated that all suppliers be producing 10ppm ULSD by June 15th, I believe, and that it be at all stations by September 15th 2006. It was posted on greencarcongress.com a few weeks ago. Even with ULSD, it's going to be very hard to meet the EPA's emissions regulations since they honestly do favor gasoline.

.

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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 12-04-2005, 05:07 AM
clett clett is offline
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Posts: 302
Default Re: can someone educate me on hybrid cars compare to diesel engine cars???

Seeing as the discussion appears to have turned to performance issues (Accord hybrid etc), I think I ought to bring up some diesel performance vehicles for comparison.

Here is a video of a BMW diesel going from 0-200 km/h-0, it's an auto.

http://www.audiogalaxy.co.uk/vids/an...0-200kmh-0.wmv

BMW's 535d also manages 0-60 in 6.3 and 155mph (electronically limited), stock.

The Opel Eco-speedster concept is not in production but manages 0-60 in 4.7s, 155 miles per hour and 113 mpg.

Regarding the torque issue, the Mercedes E320CDi is heavier and has 20 bhp less than its gasoline counterpart, but is nevertheless 0.3 s faster to 60 and goes 32% further per gallon of fuel.

Just thought I'd include these to point out that, just as with hybrids, if you want a performance oriented diesel these are available too.
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2005, 07:16 PM
AZCivic AZCivic is offline
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Real Name: Brandon
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Hybrids: 1997 Civic HX
Posts: 878
Default Re: can someone educate me on hybrid cars compare to diesel engine cars???

As another data point in the never-ending gas hybrid versus diesel debate, Dodge has a Build your own Dodge Caliber tool online. It's supposed to be a multi-ranging vehicle; it starts way down at $13,285 but can be optioned up to a stunning $32,030 if you pick ALL the options.

Here's the relevant part though; the diesel engine is a $5400 option. Yeah. $5400! They don't even list the fuel economy online, but if I had to guess, I'd say that most likely it isn't even a big improvement over the available gas engine. In the never ending debate about making hybrid or diesel "pay for itself" I don't know if it's even mathematically possible for a $5400 option that uses fuel which is typically more expensive than 87 octane regular anyway.

.


Last edited by AZCivic : 12-13-2005 at 07:20 PM.
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