Hello everyone,

My wife just traded in a 2005 Mercedes c320 for an '06 HCH II w/o Navi. She has driven the car about 95% of the time and most of her driving is in Baltimore City. She is currently averaging about 34 mpg in the city and she drives it just like she always drives. Last night I drove it for about 60 miles, mostly highway and I got 48 mpg. So, here is my question...

I notice that when I drive I am really sensitive to the mpg meter and so I know that it changes my driving style in an attempt to maximize my mpg. So, with all of the posts that I have read concerning hypermiling, tailgating 18 wheelers, going down hill in neutral, etc... if you drove a regular civic like that I wonder how much the mpg would impove?

Personally, I am disappointed with the fact that I have to be so much more aware of how I am driving to obtain the high mpg numbers but on the other hand slowing down may end up saving by life...

On a side note, so far I really like the car... I just ordered one for myself with the Navi for... good bye xterra with the whopping 13 mpg... !!

Anyway, thank you to everyone here that has posted.

Mark Owens

I don't know the answer to your question regarding the mileage of a regular Civic if driven with an eye towards MPG, but your post hit upon things I have been thinking about with my now 17 day old 2006 HCH.

First, let me say that everyone is certainly welcome to drive their hybrid any way they want - if getting the maximum mileage is your "thing" then go for it. On the other hand, I have no intention of tailgating trucks, shifting into neutral, "rebooting" engines on and off or any of the other techniques that the mega-milers seem to enjoy. For me - and just for me - I want to drive my car not have my car drive me.

That said, I have been schooled by my hybrid on certain driving patterns I have used in the past and the mpg meter is a real eye opener. My expereince is that by a few simple techniques like pre-coasting to a stop, driving the speed limit and feathering the gas pedal when at speed, I get a MPG figure that I am very pleased with - over twice what I got in my Acura TL S. It may not be exactly the EPA figure, but I also know that in the last 17 days I have spent about $100 less in fuel than I would have. Please send my apologies to the middle east and Venezuela if there is any revenue shortfall.

Sorry if I dragged this OT.

Dan

I don't think you have to change your driving habits "drastically" to see good mileage. I am not heavy on the gas, but keep up with them on the highway just fine (well..ok, not doing 90 like some) and get around 48-50 MPG. No tailgating semi's, no going down hill in neutral. Don't really need it, the way the engine works. I pretty much drive like I always have and do just fine. Now, if I was in my early 20's with a rocket under the hood, that might be different.

Have fun, you will enjoy it!!

Bob

Two and a half weeks ago, I sold my '05 HCH (manual transmission) and took delivery of an '06 HCH (CVT, of course). On my second tank, after just over 350 miles, my trip meter is reading 55.8mpg. I'm not coasting in neutral or drafting trucks, though. Just driving attentatively, and using the uncommon-sense techniques like acellerating modestly, avoiding speed changes, driving with the load over hills, coasting (in drive) when I know I may have to stop, and leaving space between myself and the traffic ahead.

It is my opinion that every driver, of any type of vehicle, would stand to gain a significant fuel savings by adopting these techniques into their driving. If you think about it, the only advantages that the technology in Honda hybrids offer are relatively small. The greatest of them is probably that the car shuts off when waiting at a light, and you simply cannot replicate that one in a non-hybrid. Starting with the '06 model, I'd venture to say that the iVTEC engine's ability to shut down all cylinders in certain situations is rather significant, too. Theoretically, that tech could be used in non-hybrids as well, but so far, it's not.

As for coasting in neutral, I consider that borderline cheating. I understand that it's illegal in at least some places, and it's just not how we're taught to drive a vehicle. Drafting large trucks is just flat-out dangerous for a few reasons. The one that scares me the most is that the big truck will easily clear that huge hunk of thrown tire in the highway, and I'll smash right in to it.

Anyway, I've often thought that real-time FE readouts and possibly the trip average mpg readout should be made mandatory on all new cars, hybrid or not. A couple of my friends drive BMWs that include the former, and they drive more consciously because of it.

Mark;

If you would like to take the time, read these two Threads I Posted.
I think this will show you what can be done with the HCH II without any Gimmicks.


Read these Threads that I Posted:

http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=680

http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=548

This will give you an idea of what you can do but there are sacrifices that have to be made to get (Maxium FE) know matter what the vehicle is.

Good-Luck,

Terry

tigerhonaker
2007 HAH
__________________
Click on Pictures to Enlarge:

Our very own mileage database shows what you can do if you drive a non-hybrid with mileage in mind:

http://www.greenhybrid.com/compare/m...onhybrids.html

Take a look at the standard civics averaging over 40MPG and the del sol averaging better than my HCH.

The mileage meter makes a huge difference in showing a driver how their habits affect mileage. Every car, hybrid or not, should have one. More drivers would stop their fuel wasting ways if they knew how their habits influence their mileage.

You don't actually have to tailgate trucks to draft; in fact, maintaining a safe distance from a regular car or SUV has a very noticeable benefit, I've found. Commercial trucks and vans, with their enormous drag, do of course offer a much larger benefit, but you can maintain a safe distance if you want to.

I rarely bother drafting in any form, but if you want to, the best thing to do is to find someone going your desired speed and follow them. Thus you suffer no drawbacks since you still drive your desired speed, and of course you should keep a normal distance from them, but it will help. I've definitely noticed it.

Amen. A scangage in every dash, I tell ya.
Don't a lot of BMWs and Merc's have FE meters on the dash?

Its not that you 'need' to drive differently in a hybrid- its simply that the evidence of what you're doing is staring you in the face, which guilts you into changing. Whwen you think about it objectively, you are simply adjusting to drive the way we all should have been driving in the 1st place- rationally, within the most efficient band of operation for that method of transportation.
In most normal cars there's no way to see the effects of what you're doing, and by the time you fill up and calculate the damage you can't pin it on any single thing.

There is no need to resort to any 'extreme' techniques for 'extreme' mpg. UNless you want to, as a sort of game. I don't, and regularly get entire tanks over the EPA highway estimate for mpg.

Mark-
I am not sure I understand your 'disappointment' about needing to be aware of what you're doing. You are commanding a large, very complex piece of machinery that is one of the current pinnacles of engineering effort since the invention of the wheel. It deserves your full attention when you are in it. It should amaze you in the back of your mind every time you see it. That much capability was unthinkable even 1/2 a generation ago.

We as a culture don't feel very sorry for people anymore who complain that after they diet, they put the weight back on- because its generally known by now that it takes behavioral changes along with diet changes to keep wieght off. If you keep the same sedentary or overindulgent lifestyle but go off the diet, now your caloric intake is again greater than your expenditure and you put the weight back on. So after 30+ years of hearing about this we have little sympathy anymore for those who keep looking for the magic diet elixr.

Just like dieting, there is no magic bullet of technology that will make everything all better for fuel economy- it takes the proper technology combined with personal behavior. And more often than not, behavior is more important than the technology. Unfortunately this lesson has just began to be taught to the general public. Dieting has a generation's worth of headstart.

Having said that, many simply choose to continue living (driving) as they always have. OK. Their choice, but its an informed choice at least. Everyone operates rationally within their personal context. The technology will/does benefit them as well; its just not maximized, and the benefits sometimes get erased by other behaviors or factors.

I used to drive relatively conservatively in my non-hybrid but didn't do anything special to get better fuel economy. My average was 30mpg even and my best road trip was 36mpg. After purchasing a ScanGauge (installed right on top of the dash so I don't have to look down) and learning from the pros, my efficiency has improved by roughly 25% overall. Some commutes are over 40mpg and my last highway trip in decent weather was nearly 44mpg over 120 miles. So that's an example of what can happen when you drive a conventional car with fuel economy in mind, especially on the highway.

Re: The "letting the car drive me" thing, I guess I look at the the other way around. I could just accept the fuel economy that my car wants to give me and leave it at that. Instead, it's my choice to make it do what I want. To each his own.

My EX isnt a HCHII. It will never get the mpg of a HCHII. But the HCHII wont out run the EX either. I do work on driving my EX in a hypermiling fashion. I do coast it, turn the engine off at lights, try to keep the rpms under 3k. But Im just as likely to stomp on it, and have a blast with it on the curves and hills in eastern Oklahoma and western Arkansas.

Heres a link to my tanks since the car was purchased.
http://www.greenhybrid.com/compare/m.../car/1820.html

Enjoy your new Hondas
psy