Toyota continues to state that aftermarket conversion of its Prius to a PHEV will confuse potential buyers who have been told that Prius's regenerative system will suffice and that no plug is required. Why not offer the option?
Personally I believe Toyota and others are missing a HUGH potential market niche ... those wanting out from under the Big Oil-Washington-Middle East axis of evil. With such conversion, most of us (those driving less than 100 miles per day) can break our oil habit fairly painlessly. At $3/gal gasoline, payback occurs in less than three years.
I think more than just people named Hugh will be interested. In fact it may have huge potential. So much so, in fact, that several weeks ago it was already posted in the news section that the 2008 Prius will offer plug-in ability and an impressive all-electric range.
With such conversion, most of us (those driving less than 100 miles per day) can break our oil habit fairly painlessly. At $3/gal gasoline, payback occurs in less than three years.
That depends on the source of your electricity. If your home electric provider is e.g. Green Mountain Energy that uses renewable energy (wind, sun), then yes, that's true. But if your provider produces electricity by means of oil, then you may actually be increasing dependency, as the conversion oil to electricity at power plant, transportation, charging, converting electricity back to mechanical energy, is less efficient than the HSD on its own when burning gasoline.
True enough, but as you doubtless know, the vast majority of power plants use USA coal as the fossil fuel of choice. For most of us it runs about $1 per charge overnight.
I, too like green, and as soon as they've solved the ethanol engine seals issues, I'll want an ICE that handles it. In fact, my dream car would be an a 4WD/AWD SUV (I live north of Boston) PHEV with an ICE that handled alternative fuels and is geared for mileage, rather than acceleration, as is now the case.
There is one company that has built a few aftermarket plug-in Prii, they're called <a href=http://edrivesystems.com>eDriveSystems</a>. They say they're going to start offering the service commercially this year, but it will likely cost $12K and only be availible in LA. I imagine it will be a few years before they ramp up enough to bring the cost down and expand to other locations.
I haven't read anything concrete about Toyota offering a plug-in hybrid, though there are a lot of rumors swirling around the 2009 Prius (due out in mid-2008).
I'm not sure about the North Shore, but down here in Li'l Rhody we have a "greenup" option on our electric bill that basically allows you to pay a few cents extra per kWh to get all of your electricity from renewables. So if you had a plug-in hybrid and ran it exclusively in electric mode, along with GreenUp electricity at home, you'd be off fossil fuels.
Our plan is to get PV solar panels on our roof and a plug-in hybrid in a few years when we've paid off our mortgage. Combined with an eventual geothermal heating system we'll be able to live in the city but still be pretty much "off the grid". At least, that's the theory.
. . . if your provider produces electricity by means of oil, . . .
Any rough percentages about power plant energy sources?
x% coal
y% nuclear
z% oil
?% natural gas
*% renewables
Are there any metrics about power delivery percentage?
x MWH (billable) / y MWH (generated)
The reason I ask is I suspect oil has gone down and natural gas is probably flat-lined. Being from Oklahoma, the first power plant I ever visted was gas fired . . . WOW!
Depends on what part of the country you're in. Here in Texas oil fired plants are low in number. The company I work for has one plant left that can burn oil. That plant usually burns gas instead. The rest of our units are gas with six others being coal and 2 nukes.
Renewables are great but people have to also know that at least in Texas just because you sign up for solar or wind doesn't mean you're getting your power from solar or wind. The wind turbines are in west Texas and what happens is they dump the power into the grid, but you're still getting your power from plants like the one I work at.Still it's is green but some people think there is a line that has elect. from west Texas to Houston...lol kevin
That depends on the source of your electricity. If your home electric provider is e.g. Green Mountain Energy that uses renewable energy (wind, sun), then yes, that's true. But if your provider produces electricity by means of oil, then you may actually be increasing dependency, as the conversion oil to electricity at power plant, transportation, charging, converting electricity back to mechanical energy, is less efficient than the HSD on its own when burning gasoline.
If the oil needed to produce the electricity is equivalent to the oil replaced, there could be an advantage in burning the oil outside the city (where power plants are typically located) rather than taking the car to pollute the downtown streets.
It can also be easier and more effective to feed oil to the power plant instead of multiple gas stations.
Bottom line: it would be great to have a choice, electricity and/or gasoline... that's what hybrids are about.
Best Tank = 54.2 mpg (Sep. 9'06)
Best Trip = 61.9 mpg
I think more than just people named Hugh will be interested. In fact it may have huge potential. So much so, in fact, that several weeks ago it was already posted in the news section that the 2008 Prius will offer plug-in ability and an impressive all-electric range.
(off topic) For some reason that really cracked me up, so I thank you, AZCivic!
I have heard arguments on both sides as to whether using the energy at home instead of on the road really makes a difference, and if so, what kind of difference. Without having lots of numbers at my fingertips, it seems to me that you'd need to know a lot more than the location of the emissions.
When you plug something in, the energy produced by a power station isn't transmitted intact to your appliance (any appliance you plug in, not just a car battery). First consider the energy used to bring the fuel to the power station, then creating the electricity from whatever fuel has particular efficiencies, transmission lines have particular efficiencies (which vary greatly based on things that the end user can never know for sure involving the condition of the grid and it's routing, the distances involved, etc.), the charging process has its set of efficiencies and then there's the use of the energy once it gets to the battery (that would be the mpg that you can measure).
The same can be said for gas you buy at the pump- you have to consider the energy extraction, processing, distribution/transportation to all the gas stations, plus your transportation to get to them, and all the various inefficiencies there, plus the efficient use of the fuel by the car. I have no idea which adds up to more, or what other things I'm missing (probably lots) but the answer to the question is probably still open, because any kind of technological change to reduce or eliminate energy transmission, storage, creation, or usage inefficiencies will change the calculation drastically. The government could improve many of these things now if we had the leadership, money and willpower to do it. I'm optimistic: it could happen.
I have no idea which adds up to more, or what other things I'm missing (probably lots) but the answer to the question is probably still open, because any kind of technological change to reduce or eliminate energy transmission, storage, creation, or usage inefficiencies will change the calculation drastically. The government could improve many of these things now if we had the leadership, money and willpower to do it. I'm optimistic: it could happen.
Hopefully the inefficiencies [including pollution clean-up] of each one would be reflected on the costs and final prices. Then you would choose to plug or not to plug based on prices.
Best Tank = 54.2 mpg (Sep. 9'06)
Best Trip = 61.9 mpg
PHEV bad press?
Re: PHEV bad press?
Re: PHEV bad press?
