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Could you post your actual summer vs winter numbers - if my original post doesn't hold up using them, I'll retract it, , and !

Thanks

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I have to agree with Wayne, that in general, the Hybrid will take a bigger hit % wise in winter... but maybe not much more. The reason being?

In winter a hybrid car's gas engine is less efficient, but then again, so is a non-hybrid's gas engine.

However,
In winter, a Hybrid's battery is less efficient also.
A non-hybrid car has no such battery pack to be affected.

Thus, a hybrid has two strikes against it, vs. one for a regular car.

You're still going to be saving gas though, regardless... that's the good news!

( as always, your results may varry..... )

Just one last point - even if the case can be made on a percentage basis that regular cars don't take the hit a hybrid does in winter, in an absolute measure, hybrids will still out-perform any other (or...a vast, vast majority) of vehicles in the winter. A hybrid getting 36 mpg in the dead of winter is still better than 99% of the other vehicles even if you give them pleasant sunny day on a flat road with the wind to their back.....

I'd add a third reason - a 5.0 litre V-8 is going to generate a LOT more heat than my little 1.3 L - makes sense the smaller engine would be more sensitive to cold....

*** Retired after 65,000 outstanding miles ***

D'oh!

Okay, here are the calculations again, using my best estimate of your winter/summer numbers - there is no good data (ie 10 degree data) for the Accord, and there are no real high-temp tanks for the Ranger, but here goes:

Xcel's Insight 'Per Mile' Gas Cost
============================
Summer (106 mpg): $0.0225/mile (1/106 * $2.39)
Winter (72 mpg - a whopping 32% hit!): $0.0332/mile

Xcel's Ranger 'Per Mile' Gas Cost
===============================
Summer (42 mpg): $0.0569/mile
Winter (34 mpg - a measly 17% hit): $0.0703/mile

Summer Savings, Xcel's Insight Over Xcel's Ranger: $0.0569 - $0.0225 = $0.0332/mile
Winter Savings, Xcel's Insight Over Xcel's Ranger: $0.0703 - $0.0332 = $0.0371/mile

So,

Xcel's Insight saved him more money in the winter than in the summer (over his Ranger, even though, as he correctly points out, it took a higher-percentage FE 'hit' in the winter than the Ranger)

___Follow the math … just follow the math …

Perhaps way, way up in Minnesota and points north things wouldn't work out like this, but I think the vast majority of citizens in the continental US can refute the argument that hybrids do worse in winter than non-hybrids. I also think your numbers are probably a 'worst-case' set, as you are pushing the temperature-sensitive aspects of the hybrid (ie the battery) farther than almost anyone (that's a compliment ).

I'm in Boulder CO and my Tacoma has dropped from roughly 28 to 25 or an 11% drop. My wifes Element has gone from 22 to 20 or a 9% drop.

An Boulder/Denver hybrid owners here that can share their summer/winter FE drop?

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I still have the spreadsheet open, so here we go again:

Prius 'Per Mile' Gas Cost
============================
Summer (48 mpg): $0.0498/mile (1/48 * $2.39)
Winter (42 mpg = a 13% hit): $0.0569/mile

Corolla 'Per Mile' Gas Cost
============================
Summer (35 mpg): $0.0683/mile (1/35 * $2.39)
Winter (30 mpg = a 14% hit): $0.0797/mile

Summer Savings, Prius over Corolla: $0.0683 - $0.0498 = $0.0185/mile
Winter Savings, Prius over Corolla: $0.0797 - $0.0569 = $0.0228/mile

=> Driving a Prius saves you more money (over a Corolla) in the winter than in the summer (23% more, with the numbers given)

Did you expect it to do that? Your comments seem to indicate that this example would 'seal the deal' in your favor.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong, but I'm not sure why you seem bent on refuting this. As I said at the outset, it just seems like hybrid owners wilt under the argument that their cars' advantage shrinks in the winter, (heck, I felt that way at first) when in fact, in many, many cases, they actually do better. Even your Accord example was tipped only about 5% in the Accord's favor - and I still maintain that your numbers are far from typical due to the way you squeeze every last bit of advantage from the Insight's battery.

If the issue all along was with my 'equal-percentage FE hit' assumption, well, I'll give you that - but I showed how it could still work with the hybrid taking a much higher percentage hit than the non-hybrid. (I'll probably go back and take out that assumption altogether, and just replace it with with 35%/20% hybrid/non-hybrid respectively).

Sorry if I've taken this all wrong...