OK, so on another site they are dissing the GM Yukon/Tahoe hybrid as it only gets 20 MPG US. Is this vehicle environmentally responsible? It's a 6000 lb "monster SUV".

How about the Lexus LS600hL? Same mileage, same weight. Luxury at any cost?

At what point do we give up our ravenous desires to "help save ourselves from destroying the planet"?

Just wondering how far we are willing to go. I know we have to go A LOT farther than we have.

Pearl is a
2007 Driftwood Pearl Prius
Package "B" (everything but leather, nav, and rear camera)

There are a lot of service people who need vehicles of this size to carry their tools and inventory. Their vehicle is their office. Now they typically don't want all that glass but if they are looking at getting 20 MPG versus 15 MPG, it doesn't take very long to make a difference. This means they can get a combo instead of just a sandwich and water.

We will always need hybrids in all different shapes and sizes. What we don't need are 'mock' hybrids whose mileage performance is no improvement over their gas equivalent.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

A Hybrid Yukon is responsible if you truly need it other wise no. And I do not think there are very many cases where a person would truly needs it.

$5 a gallon will do it for many And it's coming... soon.

Steve

STOP terrorism - Drive a HYBRID

Vehicles:
350 miles a week ------------ 2006 HCH II, Magnetic Pearl, w/NAVI (born on May 25, 2006)
350 miles a month ---------- 2003 Mazda Tribute ES-V6
350 miles a year (for now) - 1986 Mercedes 560SL

There are people there who really need a bigger vehicle for their careers or hobbies. If those bigger vehicles typically get 8-15 mpg, but now the hybrid version pushes that up to 20 mpg or more, then I will argue this is worth it.

I just bought an 4WD Escape Hybrid. I'm still breaking it in and learning how to drive more efficiently. But even with just a few miles under my belt (relatively speaking), I'm just shy of 23 mpg - which is better than most SUV's! In 3-6 months, I imagine I'll be up to the 30+ mpg range. Likewise, those with bigger hybrid vehicles may also go past the 20 mpg range. This is something that cannot be done with a regular vehicle.

As for luxury - this is subjective. My FEH has leather seats, power everything, navigation system, yada, yada. I feel this is the most luxurious vehicle I've owned. Yet it's still a hybrid and will still deliver the best mileage. So if a Lexus owner previously had 20 mpg and now gets 25-30 mpg, all the more power to him/her!

In other words, the hybrid is not just about getting better mileage. Not everyone wants a tiny ICE car or a Prius. The hybrid is about having that Prius, but ALSO having that regular looking car, that SUV, that luxury car, and that big vehicle while STILL getting far better mileage. It's truly a "have your cake and eat it too" scenario. Granted, my FEH won't get the mileage of a Prius, but if Prius was my only choice of hybrid (as it was for a while), then I wouldn't get one. And I know this was the sentiment for people across the nation - the Prius is a great idea, but not quite as stylish or as useful for those who want or need something else.

Now that car manufacturers are putting hybrid engines in vehicles we want, I can see hybrids appealing to more and more people. Hopefully that person who wants super luxury or a super big vehicle will see that he/she can spend a bit more on the hybrid, but ultimately save more in gas (and with rumors of gas hitting $4/gallon or more next year, this could be big!) and help the environment (and by now, even the worst offenders are becoming environmentally aware). This is only a good thing. Because with better mileage, we not only help the environment, but show we don't need quite as much oil any more. And that may eventually help push us to the next stage in cars (hydrogen, pure battery, etc.).

I bought my FEH on Nov. 10, 2007. I recently did a cross-country trip (San Francisco area to the Chicago area). From Western Wyoming to my home in CA, I travelled in frigid -9 degree weather and through heavy falling snow in the Lake Tahoe. In the mountains, the top speed was only 30 mph and the 4WD was used. On the flat roads, the average speed was 75 mph. Despite all of these conditions, I still averaged 27.5 mpg!

Emergency service vehicles come in all sizes but very few of them are in an HCH or Prius size. Ambulances need space for one or more gurneys, a medical technician and emergency supplies. Small fire vehicles that handle road side brush fires need a hundred or so gallons of water, pumps and tools. The plumber needs pipes, pipe tools, pipe repair kits and a powered snake. The payload needed by these vehicles easily outweighs the total weight of either a Prius/HCH. When it comes to transporting commuters and traveling salesmen, the Prius/HCH works quite nicely. Heck the Insight was a perfect commuter car but not for everyone.

Requirements, needs or desires, don't change because a new answer is available. Rather, the answers need to follow, to shadow the requirements. So let's have a broad range of hybrids, especially for our military. Like having a set of hammers from tack to sledge, we need the right tool for the right job.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

Bob;

I totally agree in principle with the concept of the "Right tool for the job". Sometimes what we do in real-life shapes our view of the world and at this stage in the game we would be foolish to fight that concept and ignore the basic necessities of our world.

However, I believe some of the other posters are fundamentally well motivated and have a very good point too.

For instance, will these hybrid SUV be bought by your average contractor or construction worker? Judging from their price and luxury appointments I find that VERY unlikely. What do you think? Hey, I could be wrong.
Will an emergency response service buy one or more of these "vehicles" to convert into ambulance or Fire Response duty? Somehow, I see someone getting scolded if they were ever to recommend the purchase of one (let alone more) of these pricey vehicles.

Call me a skeptic, but to me, these SUV's are targeting the folks who can afford and have the audacity to perpetuate the expression of waste and vanity... all the while deflecting the deserved criticism under the pretext of driving a hybridized (greener) platform.

Sure, proper hybridization of these vehicles should and must occur. But heck, lets apply it to the larger vehicles that truly have a chance of being used as a tool. Long gone are the days a farmer could buy a truck for a good price. Now the only trucks they can buy are loaded, more expensive and way too fancy that they run the risk of not looking work friendly at all.

Cheers;

MSantos

My sisters Accord only gets 22 mpg so is she SINNING against the planet? Drives her crazy that I get 34 mpg in my SUV. In this country we may drive what we want, but what burns me up is everybody wants the government to do something about gas prices because the oil companies are making money. Most want the cake and eat it too. If most of the cars, SUVs and light trucks were real hybrids we would be using 1/2 the oil we are importing.

Ducit Amour Hybridae
Mark Smith
Master Certifited Technician
Tempus non reparabilis fugit
"It isn't pollution that's harming the environment. It's the impurities in our air and water that are doing it."

Best Tank 35.0 MPG

I am trying to get the ball rolling on a project that adresses exactly this.

Trying to get more UTILITY out of these vehicles.

What contractor WOULDN'T buy a Vehicle that could provide 25,000 watts of clean, quiet power to a construction site?

Right now, I work at a construction site, and the gas powered generators run from 7am to 5pm wheather someone is striking an arc, or not.
You have to let the generator run, because you can't switch it on and off between every piece of metal you weld together ( and usually, the welder is high in the air, somewhere ). This is a perfect application for the FEH.

And welding ( IIRC ) is closer to 2500 watts than 25,000 watts, so the FEH would only have to run a few minutes per hour to keep charged up.
Or, you could have 5 or 10 guys welding at the same time from this one power source. Clean and quiet construction zone! ( not to mention PORTABLE ) You couldn't make these cars fast enough!

The same technology GM used in the Tahoe/Yukon hybrid is supposed to be available shortly in their fullsize pickup, presumably in 2WD and 4WD. Or maybe GM only offers the hybrid in 2WD. I'll have to check. Their website is hopeless.

At any rate, I was just wondering what others think of hybrids that actually consume a fair amount of fuel. Being aware that more than half of them that are sold will be used by one person most of the time as a "commuter car".

Using the Lexus LS 600 hL as an example, the only way I could buy one is if I won the lottery. But I don't think I would. I think it's environmentally irresponsible. I do find it funny that it gets the same mileage as the GM hybrid full size SUV. Hybrid gas guzzlers?

Pearl is a
2007 Driftwood Pearl Prius
Package "B" (everything but leather, nav, and rear camera)