As a long time car owner (meaning I keep them till they drop), I think you have to look at it practically. Ok, so you drop 5G's on a battery pack after 100,000 miles. That is about the same as I dump into my chevy's every time I have to put a new transmission and EGR/fuel injector into my blazers. They go like clockwork every 60,000 miles at around 2G per pass and the trannys go right at 100 to 120 k miles. Or at least my last 3 blazers have all behaved like this.

Now take my 81 rabbit. It went to 94 and I sold it with 256,000 miles. I sold it because I did not realize the problem it was having with a blown headgasket and sold it too early. Our 90 Camry went to this spring and it had 196,000 and I sold it because the distributer was leaking oil. Not much point in putting a $700 part into a car that old. But at the same time, the 86, 89 and 93 blazers have never made it over 130k miles with out serious money being tossed at them. Heck I have dumped over 2k$ into my blazer this year alone.

So put $5,000 into a battery pack once in the life of the car? No biggy to me. My Camry did not need a single part replaced that was not part of the routine maintenance (sparks, wires, oil, filters etc) in the first 118,000 miles. I can only hope my 07 and likely my 08 HHy will be as good!

 

Yes, I see your point, but cost to replace the battery comes up a lot. Esp. from people who are hybrid naive.

I honestly think traction battery failures are very very rare and that the battery should last 200,000 miles if you take care of your hybrid.

The only group of people who have needed replacement traction batteries are the Insight owners who have manual transmission. But that is another topic.

 

I was under the impression the battery modules could be replaced independently. Is is possible Toyota is being proactive and replacing the entire battery pack because the vehicle is so new?

 

Toyota's practice is to replace the entire traction battery, not individual modules. Apparently the concern is that a new module will have greater capacity compared to the remaining old modules and battery performance will be impaired.

If you do a Google search, I do not think you will find any suppliers that sell new battery modules for Toyota hybrids. An alternative to buying a new battery at $5K would be to buy a used battery from a salvage vehicle; but who knows how long the used battery will last.

Patrick Wong (with new traction batteries in his 2006 HiHy 4WD-i and 2001 Prius)

 

Thanks Patrick,

I hadn't thought about that. In every electronic device I own, they warn not to mix old and new batteries.

Still, I would like to see an aftermarket traction battery.

 

This is a lot of good "used" cells to recycle each time a traction battery fails. It seems like an aftermarket could be created for repair through consolidation. "Refurbished" traction batterys could them be made available with more limited warrantees and lower cost.

 

I do want to thank the original poster as we all need to know if there are any issues with our vehicles but "What are you guys talking about"? The Hybrid "traction" battery is warranted up to EIGHT YEARS! It's not likely that ANYONE would make a replacement battery for AT LEAST another 5 or 6 years as there is NO REASON to do so. Toyota is "on the hook" for these batteries so who CARES what the cost is and if they have to replace ALL of them in that period. We bought our '06 in July of 2006 so for us that means worry-free battery issues until July 2014. We only drive this puppy a little under 12K/year (I work from home and wife is a stay at home mom) so we should also be able to keep the mileage under the 100K limit in those same eight years. What's all the fuss about?

 

8 years? Heck I am just figuring out the car at 8 years. I won't even have completely read the shop manual in 8 years. That's the issue. Normally I keep a car at least 15 (although my current chevy will not make that at 14.5 years) and I try to get at least 20 out of them. 8 years it is just a pup.

I view my wifes 07 HHy as the vehicle she will drive till around 2025 give or take. My 08 HHY darn well better be running in 2028 or I will be irritated.

 

Hmmm, a 20 year life will be really tough and expensive to achieve on a hybrid vehicle that is so complex. Consider all of the ECUs: hybrid vehicle, steering, braking, air conditioner, etc. If you have the touch-sensitive screen, that is susceptible to failure.

Think about the transaxle with its two motors and the power split device (plus the rear MG if you have 4WD-i); the electric steering gear, and the inverter. Then of course, consider the traction battery.

These parts are found only in the HiHy and RX400h. If any one of those parts fail, your car is basically undriveable. I'd say you have a really good chance that you will have to replace 3 or more of those parts over a 20 year lifespan. There is also some likelihood that mechanical components will need replacement, like the water pump, etc. but those should be easier & relatively cheap to replace since most of those parts are also installed in non-hybrid Toyotas.

Production quantities are relatively small: from program start through July 2007, RX400h sales have been 50,000 units while HiHy sales have been 65,000 units. As you know, a new model will be coming out this fall. How long do you expect Toyota to stock replacement parts for the first gen HiHy and RX400h when the total US population is only 120,000 units or so?

Suppose you own a 1987 Toyota Camry (a reasonably popular vehicle in its day) and need a engine ECU. I just checked the Champion Toyota - Houston parts website. Their parts catalog does not show availability of an engine ECU: http://www.toyotaworld.com/

I think you'll be prowling junkyards to get parts during the last 5 years or more of your 20 year desired lifespan.

Patrick Wong

 

I see your point and thought about it for a few days.

The reality is that when my 08 is 20, I will be over 65 and not want to mess with maintenance on it anyway, so maybe my expectations will be tempered by age.

I have had a string of foreign cars that I got at least 15 and most 20 years out of except for my Chevy's (a dieing tribute to my UAW days). I guess I have just grown accustomed to the idea that a car is a 20 year investment and should be expected to go that long if reasonably maintained.

Maybe Toyota will come through and make it 20 on one or both? Only time will tell, but I have to say I am going into this with the idea that I will be a "toyota" man for the next 20 years.