ok, so someone wants the car to make noise? what noise? what is going to distinguish it from all the other ambient road noise? what if it is drowned out by something louder going by?

dumb.

Best fill 66.7 MPG, best tank 801.5 miles


laurie, central minnesota

Now you are talking about a two way ranging device like a TCAS. That is a very powerfull argument for putting it in all vehicles.... and that should/could drive cost down.

It is the ignorant among us that will eventually destroy us all.

My thinking is we have the most computerized cars on the road:

• electronic accelerator
• electronic gear selector
• electronic brake, ABS
• electronic steering assist
• electronic wheel speed
• general vehicle health
• GPS general position

These are the inputs that initiate acceleration and direction changes. By sharing these primary force inputs (actually commands for the primary forces) in a dynamic network, everyone can calculate the probably of impact, easily. Now we can alert not only our driver but pedestrians and cyclists can use the same information to learn about a potential impact even before the sound arrives and even a sighted person might realize "Uh Oh!"

Now we're talking a quantum improvement in safety and with that the ability to let the never tired, never distracted, always faithful computers handle sophisticated driving. ... then I can take a nap on the way to work.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

When I first heard about making my hybrid have "noise" I was skeptical- BUT-has anyone actually heard the sound that is being developed? I heard it at the Plug-in show. It is still pretty quiet and much more quiet than a regular combustion engine and you can't hear it at all from the inside. It's not bells or whistles, it sounds like a futuristic car. It is also pretty cool because it only emits sound in the direction you are going to further minimize the sound (if you are turning left, sound only is emitted on the left side of the car). It only makes sound when traveling under 20 MPH (above that your car makes noise anyway, and this sound is actually quieter than your hybrid at high speeds now).

Forcing blind pedestrians to carry devices or having transmitters seems pretty unrealistic to me, as well as burdensome.

I think the sound is great idea, and it not only addresses helping the blind, but also pets/animals and children. Would they have to carry transmitters too?
After hearing the sound I would definitely put it on my hybrid, it's easy and it seems the most direct solution for the problem (especially b/c I couldn't hear it from inside my car).
I would never put my life in the hands of other drivers and wouldn't expect to ask that of the blind community either.
Blind pedestrians depend almost entirely on sound. Even a little sound like the one I heard at the show lives.

First, I want to welcome you to the CLUB!

This is one of the best sites for hybrid electric information and sharing. But I'm sorry your first post was about a subject that you are misinformed about. Folks are welcome to post about anything within the general guidelines of not abuse ... address the argument not an ad hominem attack nor just a "click-through" to another site. Bring value and a proper quote and address the issue and you will find this a great place for dialog and an exchange of ideas. But when it comes to HR 5734, this is a subject I've been making a study of even before the the bill was introduced in April 2008.

What "Plug-in show?" When? Where? I was at Hybridfest last weekend, July 19-20, and don't remember seeing or hearing anything about it. But I wasn't everywhere, perhaps someone else remembers this?

As for the keyfob, it is really for the shoes of preschool kids, the ones killed in the back-over accidents in 2006. There were 5 blind killed in 2006 but 25 kids crushed under the rear bumpers and noise emitting exhaust pipes. That is the real end user. To understand this, the true face of pedestrian deaths, read:

"Backover and Non-Crash Events Special Crash Investigations Protecting Children in and Around Cars Lifesavers 2008" April 13, 2008, Augustus “Chip” Chidester, National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

Page 32 from the Chidester report is one example of the bloody toll we are talking about:

The tape on the vehicle marks the area that struck and killed a kid including the exhaust pipe, the engine noisy exhaust pipe, my friend. You'll also notice the ultrasonic object detector in the taped area ... the one that had been turned off. The driver had no idea the kid was there because all noise generators fail to alert the driver.

Sorry but your facts and data are in error. So friend, how many blind were killed in the five years between 2002-2006 by the Prius?

NOT ONE!

But in 2006, one year my friend, 24 kids died and were buried along with this one by sound emitting vehicles with their exhaust pipes hanging under the fatal bumpers and engines running. The Chidester report identified 50 back-over incidents and the rest had injuries, severe injuries. And you offer what, "a magic flute?" "... it only emits sound in the direction you are going ..."

No friend, you post here about this subject and you will have the facts and data offered in reply. Whistle what you wish but we're talking about bad legislation written on the bloody bodies of children who are ignored by the HR 5734 advocates.

Come back, my friend for I am not even half-way done with the claims about sound generators ... not by half. After all, today's cars already generate noise and kill 4,700 pedestrians every year. Somehow, the advocates of sound generators seem to believe they have heard "the magic flute" ... until the streets are filled with vehicles that all make the same tune ... just like the deadly din of today's streets.

The reason I advocate for the modified keyfob is it lets the driver know about these special people, something the sound generators will never do. It lets a driver distracted by their own passengers or phone call or any other traffic know that there is a pre-schooler or a blind person in the area. It also alerts by-standers who may help avoid the accident. Noise is used only as needed to alert everyone to the potential hazard, not just serve as more babbling background to irritate.

As a moderator, we are sensitive to those whose first posts do not introduce themselves but address a 'hot topic.' Such posts are often made by people who come to instigate conflict and angst rather than approaching with a welcoming, inquisitive mind. It is a pattern we are all too familiar with and even has a name. So perhaps you might describe your Camry hybrid and yourself?

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

(At the risk of making light of a serious subject...)

Alright, I've been thinking about this all afternoon and think I've come up with a solution we can all live with -- low tech/low cost will win every time! Here's my 'proof of concept', it was really begging for some duct-tape, but I couldn't find my roll at the moment.

Benton 1aug08

MPG is rising with engine break-in and warmer weather

Asking tens of thousands of hybrid owners to add noisemakers is burdensome.

Sounds like a pedophile/beastiophile (?) wet dream. "My car has a TARGET detector, cool!"

That and knowing where the heck they are. They don't tend to be walking from the parking lot into Sears down at the mall, unattended, since they typically didn't drive there themselves. Getting from one corner to the next on the street is a more typical situation, and here I think there are other options that would be applicable to the situation.

Benton 2aug08

MPG is rising with engine break-in and warmer weather