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Old 01-23-2007, 01:52 PM
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Smile Ford flexes hybrid muscle

Automaker plugs its fuel cell Edge on Capitol Hill Detroit Free Press 01/23/07 by Justin Hyde


WASHINGTON -- As President George W. Bush prepares to offer his latest ideas for reducing the U.S. energy bill, Ford Motor Co. will have its idea tooling around the Capitol this week: a hydrogen-powered, plug-in hybrid electric vehicle.

While the theories behind Ford's HySeries Drive system sound similar to General Motors Corp.'s Chevrolet Volt unveiled at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit, Ford's version has one Edge -- a working prototype installed in its new crossover that it will show to lawmakers, administration officials and other Washington types this week.

Both vehicles will be on display at the Washington Auto Show this week, as Detroit automakers promote their alternative energy research to an audience that's growing increasingly concerned with global warming and U.S. reliance on foreign sources of oil.

"We're not going to be seeing these in our driveways anytime soon," said Jim Kliesch, research associate with the American Council for an Energy Efficient Economy, an environmental group. "But it does indicate Detroit is paying attention to some alternative areas of interest."

The HySeries drive has five basic parts: a fuel cell, a hydrogen tank, two electric motors and a lithium-ion battery pack from the joint venture between Johnson Controls Inc. and European battery maker Saft. With fully charged batteries, the Edge can go about 25 miles on electricity alone, with a few more miles available if the driver wishes. Once the batteries discharge about 60%, the fuel cell switches on to power the electric motors and recharge the battery pack, providing another 200 miles of range.

The test Edge can get the hydrogen energy equivalent of 41 m.p.g. of gasoline, but Ford says a driver who travels fewer than 50 miles a day would get fuel economy well over 80 m.p.g. Unlike GM's Volt, Ford's HySeries was developed from the company's fuel cell efforts. While hydrogen fuel cells offer electric power with no emissions, hydrogen doesn't hold as much energy as other fuels, and has to be stored at high pressures to deliver acceptable range. Ford's fuel-cell engineers figured out that by using batteries to store extra electrical power, they could both increase the range of fuel-cell vehicles while using a smaller fuel cell and hydrogen tank.

Mujeeb Ijaz, Ford's manager of fuel-cell vehicle engineering, said Ford also decided to use a fuel cell for its plug-in hybrid because it was the hardest combination to package inside a vehicle. Ijaz said that allows Ford to swap out the fuel cell in the HySeries for a regular gasoline or diesel engine with little trouble, like GM claims for the Volt.

"We've crossed the bridge of whether this vehicle is viable," said Ijaz as he drove the HySeries Edge around downtown Washington. "Now the issue is commercialization."

While the prototype allows Ford to test several systems -- such as the one that prevents the Edge from being driven if it's still plugged into an electrical outlet -- cost remains the largest barrier to production. After much hype earlier this decade, most experts say it could take decades for fuel cells to become widely available. Ford said battery prices remain the top impediment to plug-in hybrids, but the vehicles could be feasible in a few years.

"It's great for us to have this technology...but we have to make a product," said Ijaz. "If we don't make a product with this, it's all for naught."

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Old 01-24-2007, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

I was reading that someone has devolped a "fuel cell" that uses alcohol to produce the electricity. Enough electricity would be created from one gallon for 65 miles of EV ( below 40 miles per hour ) driving in the Ford Escape.

Now... 65 MPG from a renewable fuel, with no high pressure hydrogen tank sounds good to me. Weight would be pretty heavy at this point, about twice the weight of the stock HV battery... the only drawback so far...

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Old 01-24-2007, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

Quote:
Originally Posted by gpsman1 View Post
I was reading that someone has devolped a "fuel cell" that uses alcohol to produce the electricity. Enough electricity would be created from one gallon for 65 miles of EV ( below 40 miles per hour ) driving in the Ford Escape.
Whoao...not a good idea. The driver may just get thirsty, hook his straw to the gas tank while driving....

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Old 01-24-2007, 11:04 AM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

A fine idea actually... as all fuel alcohol is "denatured" with a poison to make it unfit for human consumption. ATF already thought of that!

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Old 01-24-2007, 12:05 PM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

I bet someone would still try it and end up in the mourge!

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Old 01-24-2007, 04:03 PM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

Alcohol in the fuel tank, hmmm... not the world's most novel concept (In fact, it's a movie standard for when there's a sputtering tank and the gas runs out. someone will invariably pull out a bottle of some sort of alcohol, try to start the engine, and then- BOOM! out falls some critical part. They did it in The Great Race, Back to the Future III, The Gods Must be Crazy II... oh, I feel like I've seen it bunches of times). Besides, I agree with occ and mppkll- some idiot will definitely poison themselves on this (happens sometimes with rubbing alcohol and other odd forms of alcohol that aren't meant for drinking, apparently) so any car maker that uses it will have the inevitable liability issue arise.

Still, the bit about getting the 'hydrogen energy equivalent of 41 mpg' is fairly abstract. Out of context like that, it just doesn't mean anything. If you're measuring in terms of energy, then you need the power produced and the distance driven- gallons don't enter into it, because there is nothing you have gallons OF. A fuel cell, hydrogen tank, batteries and electric motors- where are the gallons? Maybe back at the power plant, burning oil to break down water molecules into H2 and O2, or generating electricity? Hard to say. If they're trying to compare something to something here, it isn't apples to apples. Maybe not even apples to kangaroos- I just can't really tell.
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Old 01-24-2007, 05:14 PM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

#1 it sounds like you all have never heard of E85 and "Flex Fuel" vehicles already on the road??? 85% "beverage" ethanol runs those cars today. Ford built cars in the 1910's to run off 100% ethanol.

#2 If people choose to drink fuel ethanol... then hey... it will remove poor genes from the gene pool... sounds like a win/win situation to me!

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Old 02-02-2007, 04:38 AM
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

Ford To Deliver Demonstration Fleet of Ethanol Fueled Hybrids to Six States

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Old 02-02-2007, 02:11 PM
leahbeatle leahbeatle is offline
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Default Re: Ford flexes hybrid muscle

Some of the claims in that article are just odd- I guess it's a press release more than an article, though. Thanks for posting it, even so.
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