Gas Prices Having Some Impact on Vehicle Choices - GreenHybrid

Delta Flyer · #1 (**permalink**) 03-29-2006, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta dealer

The need (????) hasn't changed for the big SUV, The issue is that people's pocketbooks have changed and they're not interested in spending the money for the fuel any more

...at least some of them

Good news - the H2 is going to be required to get 22.3mpg by 2011 - about double of what it gets now. It will have to be hybridized or phased out in favor of the H3. This is assuming GM is is around and Jerry York does not ax the Hummer as he has expressed...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Becker - Sierra Club

What the President is proposing will only save two weeks of oil over a four year period of time, not very impressive

MSNBC Story

coyote · #2 (**permalink**) 03-29-2006, 10:00 PM

When I read that article, I wondered: are the EPA numbers that they state using the newer, more realistic EPA measuring methods? Or will they still be measured using the same old unrealistic EPA methods that we have today?

If those MPG numbers that they state are with close-to-real-world measurement techniques, then these requirements are much more impressive.

AZCivic · #3 (**permalink**) 03-30-2006, 05:47 AM

Well, the H2 won't really have to get 22mpg, because of the way CAFE works. As long as GM makes enough small cars that get classified as trucks (the HHR might qualify, same as the PT Cruiser did) that exceed their CAFE targets then they can sell vehicles that do not meet CAFE without any penalty. Or...they can just go ahead and pay the CAFE penalties. That's what BMW does since they've never been in compliance with CAFE. That's part of why BMW's carry a price premium; you're paying their CAFE fines in the sticker price.

Delta Flyer · #4 (**permalink**) 03-30-2006, 05:54 AM

AZCivic,

Agreed the 22.3mpg for the H2 by the EPA is not real world, but that's quite a leap when it probably gets just half that in the real world (currently is not tested by the EPA). If they can't meet the target, don't just slap on the CAFE fines - eliminate the tax breaks!

Katz6768 · #5 (**permalink**) 03-30-2006, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delta Flyer

Good news - the H2 is going to be required to get 22.3mpg by 2011 - about double of what it gets now. It will have to be hybridized or phased out in favor of the H3. This is assuming GM is is around and Jerry York does not ax the Hummer as he has expressed...

The bad news is if they double their MPG, H2 owners will start driving twice as much and more people will be tempted to buy these monsters.

The US and Canada will look more like Iraq and Afghanistan with more "military" vehicles and "tough" guys driving around.

Delta Flyer · #6 (**permalink**) 03-30-2006, 06:34 AM

Think about it: the H2 has a Cd of about 0.50 (more or less), weighs 8,500 pounds, enormous tires, four-wheel drive. People drool over Hummers because it's inheritantly designed to be a gas guzzler (on civilian roads - it uses only 25% of what an Abrams battle tank does).

So how can the Hummer double it's fuel economy and still look like a 350-pound wrestler on crack and steroids? The only option is a super-fuel efficient engine. My guess is the kind of powerplant that would give an H2 23.3mpg would get a Prius an EPA rating of 100mpg - good luck GM.

sasparilla · #7 (**permalink**) 03-31-2006, 10:30 AM

Make her out of Carbon Fiber too (they're so expensive why not) and then she'll only weigh 5,000 lbs, add some giant LRR tires (I'm lauging as I type this) and the 23.x mpg average is within reason.

Then all the former H1 & H2 (plus other people who wanted one but couldn't stomach it) could buy them, cause they're "better" for the environment.

Adam_HybridCivic · #8 (**permalink**) 03-31-2006, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delta Flyer

Think about it: the H2 has a Cd of about 0.50 (more or less), weighs 8,500 pounds, enormous tires, four-wheel drive. People drool over Hummers because it's inheritantly designed to be a gas guzzler (on civilian roads - it uses only 25% of what an Abrams battle tank does).

So how can the Hummer double it's fuel economy and still look like a 350-pound wrestler on crack and steroids? The only option is a super-fuel efficient engine. My guess is the kind of powerplant that would give an H2 23.3mpg would get a Prius an EPA rating of 100mpg - good luck GM.

Chuck, just for the record according to Hummer's website the H2 weighs 6,400 pounds not 8,500. Sorry I wasn't trying to be a bummer, I just know that my truck weighs 5,800 pounds and when I heard the figure of 8,500 pounds I though that might be a little off. So, having a carbon fiber body might not be such a bad idea anyway.

Anyway good job summing up the fact that GM will never accomplish a 23 MPG Hummer unless they turn it into a skate board.

By the way you can see I own a gas guzzler that is a necessity. When Ford comes out with the Hydraulic F-150 I am first in line!

Delta Flyer · #9 (**permalink**) 03-31-2006, 02:22 PM

I may have been confusing the H2 with the original Humvee.