Nice list! I had a few adds of my own...

-- They make wild claims about how bad the used up batteries will be for the environment, never mind the gazillion cell phone batteries out there that get thrown out every two years (or less).
-- Or they state it will take 10 years to recover the cost, based on comparing the Prius to another car you'd never consider owning in the first place, as if they were comparable.
-- They talk about the Prius like it was the only hybrid on the market or the only basis of discussion for any hybrid issue
-- When they calcluate cost/benefit, they use a gas price from two years ago (at least for me - like when was gas $2.50 a gallon - I can't even remember).

I really like the idea of a formal "hybrid myths" page/thread and make it a permanent spot. Would be an easy thing to send journalists...

*** Retired after 65,000 outstanding miles ***

Yeah, my favorite comparison in "hybrid hate" is when they compare a top-shelf Prius with all the gadgets ($26,000) to a stripped down Corolla with a 5-speed MT ($16,000).

Now, I'm guessing that the Corolla in question would no longer be $16,000 if you gave it the Prius technological items like:
-- Drive by wire CVT (vs standatd 5MT)
-- Miller/Atkinson cycle (vs Otto cycle)
-- Rear-view backup camera.
-- System status monitor.
-- Navigation kit.
-- Power windows/brakes/mirrors, etc.
-- Keyless entry
-- High-end stereo w/ MP3+iPod connectors (vs standard 4-speaker CD+FM)
-- Extra power ports for various gadgets.

So if you added all this technology to a Corolla, a potential Prius owner *might* consider it, but then you'd be lookong at a $22,000 car and not a $16,000 car. At that point, if your money was tight, you could just scrap the Nav kit and buy the Prius for $22,000!

But hey, I'm just using logic here!

My other "hybrid hate" is when they tout how the Civic Hybrid isn't a "real" hybrid because it doesn't have an EV mode. So, the 20 HP IMA is window dressing? There's *something* inside that car that makes it get 11 MPG more than the regular Civic! Geeeeeez! And the price difference between a Civic LX and a HCH is only about $1500. The LX vs HCH is a much fairer comparison since the trim levels in both cars are very similar.

(BTW... I added the "hybrid hate" rebuttal to my "Hybrid mini-forum" page. Just click the blue link below.)

Sadly a lot of people live by Joseph Goebbels concept that if you repeat something often enough - people believe it. Sorry to make a reference to Nazism, but it's starting to seem like the point of these anti-hybrid articles is not the factual accuracy, but exposing the public to them again and again until they conclude - "it must be true". The GM ad in the article this thread is about sort of makes you wonder. There is a lot of propaganda out there....

Another forum just had a rehash of the alleged danger in hybrids of electromagentic field radiation. This forum has discussed it. The wavelength is 100,000 times longer than the radiation in cell phones that may put heavy users at risk of brain cancer. It's also apples and oranges to compare EMF with nuclear radiation.

We go from paranoia to denial. For instance, it's been proven that SUVs have a higher rollover rate and don't have to meet the stricter car safety standards, yet many people declare them to be safer because they "feel" that way.

For that matter, some think there is an Apollo moon landing hoax, even though the Russians don't dispute it happened and there are pictures.

Some people are on a mission to influence your opinion and could not care less if it's true or not.

Some people cling to an opinion even in the face of clear evidence it's not true.

61.5mpg lifetime - 82mpg in recent months

Best Run >
www.cleanmpg.com

"fanatic" is what the lazy call the dedicated

It is nothing more than a DRAFT but this is my first attempt:

http://hiwaay.net/~bzwilson/prius/pri_skeptics.html

In reality, we need a Wiki interface instead of a Wobert.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

That's a pretty good first draft! I like it!

Hi,

I just added the "Hybrid gas tax" argument too. The counter is to point out the high cost of gas is causing gas only drivers to drive slower or use smaller gas-only cars. Then ask, "What is the shortfall?", "How many hybrids are in your state?" and "How high should the hybrid only gas tax be to make up the shortfall?"

There have only been 500,000 Prius sold world-wide and a penny per gallon increase would only raise $5,000 per gallon. But the hybrids do not all reside in one state and the actual number of hybrids in the state, even the most populous, is a fraction of the total number of vehicles.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

I haven't heard the "hybrid gas tax" argument before. That's pretty funny. I guess people who use this argument would also say we need to increase smoking to increase the associated tax revenue.

I just added the EMI hazard. Some implanted medical devices are programmed and dump their recorded incidents via a high frequency magnetic field. So far, all hybrid EMI tests have shown they are at ambient noise levels. The biggest hazard for those with medical implants is they have to give up arc welding.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

To: Our friends, the moderators.

This thread is taking a life of its own and I'm partially responsible. Later tonight, I'll take my DRAFT answer to the skeptics and break it up by subject and repost into "Anything goes." This will let the membership help add and edit the areas of interest. Then after a couple of weeks, we'll look at reassembly into a "Sticky" note essay.

My DRAFT is meant more as an introduction to the common skeptical arguments we've seen in the past. But there is more needed, especially if we're going to write a letter to the reporter or editor. That research effort is more than one person can do, easily. But if we break up the research task into managable pieces and share the load, we can put something together very quickly. A lot of the details can be harvested from the archived messages already here and in other forums.

Once we have a baseline, then a 'duty editor' can keep it current and we'll have something useful for our membership. Instead of getting mad, we'll facts and data to get even. <GRINS>

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.