http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayS...74&docid=30889

Looks like a vastly better Green Line Vue is on it's way. Almost like they're admitting the current model is a mistake and not worth mentioning.

First 4WD Hypermiler

Have you read the FEH FAQ?

Live in Michigan? Let it be known in Michigan Roll Call

Read My Automotive Blog at Rich Rambles

Uh Oh! Someone needs to send a copy of CNW Marketing's "Dust-to-Dust" report. A new design will obviously suffer a terrible 'carbon cost' . . .

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

Go back and read some of my posts where I said things like "I can only talk about products released to the press" or "I can only talk about products that have been publicly announced". Well this is one of the products I could not talk about then. What's the point? The point is that the 2008 VUE 2-Mode has been in the works for several years. It is one part of a well thought out strategy, not a response to the currently available BAS Green Line.

So if the 2-Mode is so great, why was the BAS Green Line released first? Simple. From a technology implementation stand point, it is an easier application. It was ready first. Also notice that the 2008 VUE is totally changed from the 2007. The FWD 2-Mode was develop coincident with the change to the new VUE chassis and design. The BAS system is more transportable across vehicle designs, so it could more easily be developed for the 1st design VUE and carried over to the new design.

The BAS is also less costly to produce, therefore offering a lower price to the consumer. What you'll see when the 2008 2-Mode is available is the basis of the GM hybrid strategy. One model at a modest price with modest fuel economy improvement. This allows people who want a hybrid but can't afford to pay - $3 - 5,000 above the base vehicle price to still experience a hybrid. Another high tech / high fuel economy model for people who want the maximum improvement in fuel economy and are willing to pay the option price for it.

Peace,

Martin

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

Yeah, but take a look at all the upset VUE owners. That can really damage the brand view (Only slight pun intended) in the eyes of future consumers (Who, as we see from reports, do most of their research online before ever visiting a dealer). You have people who are returning it after purchasing it, people outraged at the poor MPGs, and others wishing they hadn't bought the hybrid technology already.

If they had waited and released them together, the 2 mode for people who want some serious MPGs, and BAS for people who don't want to fork out the dough, it would be a different story; and probably a neat innovative idea. Since they were so far behind in the game, why they didn't seems puzzling to me.

Seems to me that GM is taking a serious risk damaging the way people look at GM hybrids. A once burned approach is enough for most consumers when it comes to cars and manufacturers. It's bad enough when people won't buy the Big 3 because of a model they didn't like in the '80's, but to tell them just a few months later that they've improved both seems like a giant slap in the face to current owners and an act of deception at the hands of GM Execs.

In addition, they're also facing the damage done by Who Killed the Electric Car; it's not really a good time to take too many miss steps.

First 4WD Hypermiler

Have you read the FEH FAQ?

Live in Michigan? Let it be known in Michigan Roll Call

Read My Automotive Blog at Rich Rambles

Will it have an instant MPG gage? Without some feedback, even in a non-hybrid car, it is difficult to get folks to start driving efficiently.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

Absolutely right, Bob!
I had no idea how true this fact is, until I first had a car with instant MPG. If you don't see what bad habits cost you in MPG, you tend to underestimate their toll.

Steve

STOP terrorism - Drive a HYBRID

Vehicles:
350 miles a week ------------ 2006 HCH II, Magnetic Pearl, w/NAVI (born on May 25, 2006)
350 miles a month ---------- 2003 Mazda Tribute ES-V6
350 miles a year (for now) - 1986 Mercedes 560SL

Can anybody say early 80's GM diesle engines in cars.

GM tried to convert a gas engine into a diesel engine without any block improvements, and the engine was a pathetic dog as far as performance and reliability.

Now they seem to be repeating old habits.

Give the consumer a dog, so they won't even look at the better product.

Smart marketing!

Other than on this site and a couple other "hybrid savvy" forums, I have not seen the level of dis-satisfaction that you are noting. It obviously exists among people who have a pre-conceived notion that hybrid = Prius level fuel efficiency or double digit mpg improvement (in real mpg, not %). The BAS Green Line is not targeted at those people. Even on this site, I'm seeing about a 50 / 50 like it / don't like it split amongst owners. Obviously not what I'd personally like to see, but again, this site is not a barometer for the general buying public. Quite honestly, the VGL seems to be selling very well.

In this business tough decisions are made all the time. Many are good ones, some are not. Typically if you have a product ready for launch, you launch. There is very rarely any benefit to delaying a launch. Given the two radically different target markets, launching VGL when it launched makes perfect sense. Time will tell if it is the right decision.

Not certain I really understand the BLUE part, particularly the underlined part. Not clear where the deception came in. I do get and appreciate your point wrt the '80s. The VGL has always been described as a mild hybrid with modest fuel economy improvement at a low price. The 2-Mode has always been discussed as a high tech potentially high cost system that will deliver world class fuel economy improvements. The only issue not disclosed was (and remains) full detail on which vehicles will get BAS and which vehicles will get 2-Mode. That's plain and simple Product Planning 101. Don't tip your hand on future product until it suits you.

I won't really comment on this because I haven't seen it. I also only know a handful of people who have seen it. Their view of GM seems to be unchanged by that. (These are people who do not work for GM, some drive GM cars, others don't)

Peace,

Martin

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

Martin --

This sounds more like the VUE I was expecting, based on Saturn's response to my email back in 2003:

Our advanced hybrid system will be designed specifically for U.S. driving
patterns and will optimize both city and highway fuel efficiency. This
system will be more functional alternative to other gas/electric hybrids.
The VUE Hybrid is expected to boost fuel efficiency up to 50 percent.

I'll be very interested in test-driving this one when it makes it to my local dealership!

Purrs,
Debbie




I my FEH

I knew it was when you mentioned it. I was very concerned that it was being openly discussed by customer relations people before it was publicly announced. That's why my response to your question was VERY vague. I could not tell you that what you were told was NOT true. That would have been a lie. I also could not confirm it back then.

Peace,

Martin

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues

I am NOT the official voice of GM with respect to Hybrid issues