Hi all,

I have not had a car for over six years (have been a public transportation-reliant urbanite), but am now planning on getting a hybrid vehicle when I move in August to Palo Alto, CA. I have read through some of the older threads comparing the Prius and CHC and have found them incredibly informative.

I am planning on buying a 2006 Prius or CHC sometime in late August or early September. I will probably opt for a more basic package, though I am pretty set on getting a navigation system. I imagine the factory-installed systems are preferable (and I realize that this will certainly push me beyond any of the basic packages), though I have not done any research yet to fully appreciate the cost difference and pros/cons of a factory-installed vs. off-the-shelf nav system.

With that background, here are my questions:

(1) What should I expect for cost of an '06 Prius with navigation system vs. an '06 CHC with navigation system post-federal tax credit (I'm assuming that I will still be able to get the credit for both at the end of the summer)?

(2) While I will certainly be doing a lot more research and test-driving, I would also greatly appreciate anyone's opinions on which car I should get, all things considered (i.e., cost, style, latest reviews, differences in reliability, personal biases, etc. etc.). If you had to make a choice, which would it be?

(3) If I go for a Prius, does anyone have any sense of when I would need to put my name on a waiting list to get one in a specific color (probably either the blue or silver-green) by end of August/early September?

Thanks in advance for any replies and apologies for my long-winded post. I'm definitely very glad to have come across such a great resource as I start gearing up for my new car purchase!

On your first question, start tracking the sale price on Ebay. Search for 'prius' and then look at the completed listings. This will give an idea of the 'free market value' of Prius.

On the third question, it is nearly impossible to predict anything about the hybrid market in six or seven months. As a general rule, the more buying options, dealers, the more likly you are to get a good deal. Have your financing arranged with your bank or credit union before you walk in the door. Then be prepared to walk away from a deal that isn't quite right.

One wild-card, an option I didn't have in 2001, is to buy a used Prius. It can save a bunch and if it has been well maintained, one owner, a fairly low risk option. Again, I'd recommend watching Ebay to look for the free market value.

The best thing is you are starting early. The rule of thumb in life is: good, fast, cheap, pick two of three. Starting early means 'cheap' and 'good', an excellent choice.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

Great advice, Bob -- thank you!

Go test drive the cars now.
Then negotiate your best price, now - but all just for practice.

Buying a new car isn't something we do everyday.
Selling new cars IS something dealers do everyday.
So buyers are at at disadvantage when it comes to comfort level negotiating for price.
Get some practice in; just walk out before you sign the papers.

Don't buy in a big city, buy in a rural area.
I live in Los Angeles and they are getting thousands over sticker because of high demand.
I bought 300 miles away in Bishop California for $1000 under sticker.

Price in Sept/Aug will depend of gas prices.
Even oil future traders on Wall Street don't know what's going to happen in the world that far out.

In 2004 I test drove the Prius and Civic hybrids, and bought the civic.
Here is what I didn't like about the Prius.
The visibility out the back window is blocked by the air dam.
The styling SCREAMS hybrid and LOOK AT ME!
I'm more of a low-key kind of guy who would rather blend in like the Honda styling.
The fit finish and feel of the Honda interior felt better quality to me.
I didn't like the display in the middle of the PRius's dash board - very odd.
The Prius display has lots of soft-keys so you have to press a bunch of buttons on the display to get down to the button you want.
Makers love this because it is cheaper to make - fewer parts.
Oh the Honda there is a physical button for everything - this is faster simpler and safer while driving.

Last month I bought a 2006 Honda Civic Hybrid- my second Honda hybrid.
That is the best testimony for Honda hybrids.

My 04 is for sale now.

Need fewer troops to support.
Drive a hybrid.
Best tank 71.65 MPG.

Before this car I spent two years learning hypermiling on my 2004 HCH1.

Hi,

I guess I forgot to mention why for my family, the Prius is a better fit:

Higher above ground - my wife has had two back surguries and spondelosthsis (sp?), which means squatting down to get in a lower car is more painful. The Prius is taller, like our Echo, and that helps her a lot. For the same reason, climbing up into an Escape is a problem but this is unique to our family.

Electric only mode - for this engineer, the ability to run only on battery-motor is very attractive. Future, larger batteries could provide short range, 2-5 mile, electric only trips with the potential for grid charging. This would solve the short-trip, warm-up inefficiency problem.

You might look at the fleet performance data to see what happened to both the HCH and Prius after 160,000 miles (see "Fleet Performance" thread.) It includes a maintenance summary but most impressive was after 160,000 miles, they were both getting excellent MPG. We don't really know the real "end of life" since 160,000 miles was arbitrarily choosen.

The Honda Civic Hybrid is a fine car and the manual transmission version has gotten exceptionally high MPG (See mileage database.) Although I love manual transmission cars, my wife has told me "NO" due to a knee problem.

Bob Wilson

Operation Iraqi Oil Freedom:

Automatic, stock, project car.

My other 1500 cc car:

Automatic, stock, backup car.
Free speech, dialog and knowledge thrives without the poison of SPAM.

For the most part, I think they are both quality vehicles and it's going to come down to personal preference.

Test drive them both...or even better, rent one of each for a couple of days. See which one you like better.

For what it's worth, I just bought an '06 Prius after having two Honda Civics and a VW Rabbit in the past and I love the Prius. I didn't get the NAV, but did get the Vehicle Stability Control (an option I don't think is available on the Civics yet), the SKS, and the HID headlights. I'm very happy with my option package.

2006 Barcelona Red Metallic Prius (HK #6)
February 8, 2006

That VSC is worthwhile!! You could think of it as ABS for side to side motion.

Last winter, I was driving down a major road (slowly) in the arly morning, in major whiteout conditions. The stoplight turned red just as I was approaching the intersection. I touched the brakes, hoping I wouldn't slide into the middle of the intersection. I stopped with just the nose of my Prius in the intersection, thanks to VSC (the display lights up when VSC kicks in). If not for VSC, I would have stopped in the middle of that intersection.

My wife skidded while driving. She said the car didn't fishtail as expected. The back just wobbled a bit and the car stopped after a couple inches.

We're sold on VSC from personal experience.

Infael

2004 Gray Prius with smart start/entry and VSC

You can't get the NAV system in the lower priced option packages in the Prius. I still bought the Prius without the NAV, but was tempted by the HCH because I could get the NAV for an extra $1k. In the Prius it was going to cost me about $4k in upgrades that I did not really want. So I just use my handheld GPS when I really need it, which isn't really that much.

Prius 06 Black Pack#2

An interesting possible future option for the Prius is upgraded batteries for better EV mode. See this link http://www.edrivesystems.com/technology.html

While the price is outrageous today ($11k+) it could/should fall over the next few years. I'm hoping that this system (or even better a system provided by Toyota) will offer a true EV mode for the Prius at around $4K. If this would happen the Prius would become a true plug-in hybrid and that would be cool. I also think a lot of people would then look to buy a used Prius and upgrade the batteries. That all said it's justa pipe-dream at the moment.

Not sure a similar thing can be done for the Honda as the IMA system uses weaker electric motors.

For me the closer to EV technology in the Prius was the reason I decided to buy it instead of the Honda

1. Cant answer the Nav question.

2. I chose the Prius because it was asteticly pleasing and looks different, I like the layout the split window took a week to get used to, but now it does not affect the blind spot. You sit higher in the car, Im 6'3" 275 lbs and ride /drive very comfortably. The next hybrid I buy will be a toyota, I have had no problems to speak of aside from normal maint. oil changes, tire replacements.

My wife love the car so much she doesnt let anyone drive it...
Hers is a #4

The #1 is the basic I would think if you asked for it you could get the NAv sys installed.. (mind you the basic comes fully loaded compared to most of your standard/ non-hybrids..

The warr is nice too
8yr / 100k on the electrical side
3yr/36k basic
5yr/60k drivetrain
7yr/75k extended

A Fully loaded 06' should start around $27,162

You build your own here:

http://configurator.setbuyatoyota.co...&carname=prius

Check out this link to compaire the prius to other car makes and models:

http://www.toyota.com/toyotacomparat...nComparator.do


I have gone to car shows with our marked prius and the first question is, do you have to plug it in??? I say no, thier eyes light up and they say wow thats great! I now think if you plug the car in and charge the battery for short EV trips that would be cool and still have the ice to fall back on if you need to floor it.... (yes I changed my thinking a little)

I

Driving is not a rite its a privlage..

04' # 5, W/leather & JBL omitted.
"Prius, Just ask the person that drives one"
04' Tundra, 18mpg city & 22mpg hwy.
04' Prius, 60mpg city & 53mpg hwy.

Kenstyle NHW20 AERO Kit