I meant, when you put the car in the hands of those 100K buyers. 99% of them will achieve no more than 46-48mpg. Do you dispute this, your own experience and those few others like yourself notwithstanding ?

BTW - This is the second thread I can think of where you have misconstrued what I was saying. The first time, I chalked it up to lack of clarity on my part. I'll say the same here, but your personal jab is uncalled for. Funny...I thought Xcel would be the one who would jot off a reply in defence, insulting me in the process, when I meant him no personal ill will. Instead, I get...you. No matter. I'll dissect the rest of your reply now.


Because invariably, once the fallacy of the promoted FE of the vehicle is brought up(again, for the average driver, in average conditions) , you (Prius advocates in general...see...am I being clear now ?) bring up the canard that the Prius is so much cleaner than anything else out there. It's a fallback defence, and doesn't stand in the face of evidence to the contrary, either. So I thought I'd be proactive. If you think I just 'attacked' the Prius out of the blue, then I'm not the one who's sleepy - go back and re-read the last few posts.


Funny how you selectively quote me. I did say that I was wearing my tinfoil hat, did I not ? Since the owner of this site is on record that they would not remove data under any conditions, this exemplifies how (in)valid the data really is, or how easily it can be manipulated to advantage. As to 'obvious' error - that would be subjective. You're right about the low person in the db - I did not notice them. Granted, the 516mpg car (or whatever it is - I can't check at the moment) caught my eye. Isn't it funny how no error like that has been made in all of this time - until now, when the HCH-II starts out with such promise, being driven by...newbies ? (not all, but many are first-time hybrid drivers - or does Honda only sell the cars to hypermilers?) Oh - and since you brought up what a 'real' attempt to inflate the numbers would look like, how do we know that that is not already happening (in that fleet, or any other ?) How many of these cars - actually exist ? Just something to think about, since we're talking about conspiracy theories.


And now, I'll ask you - is this on-topic ? You could accuse me of being overly loyal to a marque, but 'black and white' is not applicable here. I'm arguing about which is perceived to better, based on results vs. promotion, vs. which actually delivers on the promises made. I prefer to think of it as not believing all the marketing hype I hear coming from TMC. That is where this site is useful to me - it's not owned by HMC or TMC.

Using the new P&G techniques, and in knowledgeable hands, why should I not think it possible ? I recall reading a thread Xcel posted stating that he took another persons 1st-gen HCH and got 126mpg with it, in what amounted to city traffic speeds. You know what's scary ? The '06 HCH drivers are starting to see this for themselves. And even scarier - Xcel hasn't had a chance to drive one yet (at all, much less for any period of time). When he does - let's see what he gets.
But I digress. Looking back on your quote, I see you made the qualifying statement "in my hands". Well, that would be a good question. What I do know is that as biased as I am toward HMC, you are just as biased toward TMC - your statement proves it. So...your statements about me only seeing things in 'black & white', and 'most liking both' (HCH & Prius) 'just fine'...seem a bit disingenous.

I extend my apologies, as promised.

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OK, I'm no guru, nor am I as experienced as most of you who are regular posters. However, from everything I've read, both by reviewers as well as posters, it seems clear to me that the Prius' strength is in city driving and the Civic's strength is in highway driving. I drive 42 miles each way to work, 99% being highway, so I'm really glad I bought an HCHII. However, if I lived in Manhattan (and could afford a car) I would think that the Prius would be the better choice. That being said, I'm not sure head-to-head comparisons between the two cars are on-point or productive. I realize that people do tend to gravitate toward brands that they have experience with, so I understand the tendency to go "rah, rah, my team vs. your team". While it's fun to bust each others' chops from time to time, we shouldn't let it get personal.

(Climbing down off of soap-box).

Don

Well if it remains an ASSIST electric motor... it will never be able to (there is one case that can do this but it will probably damage your car). IMA stands for what (no need to respond to this...)?

It's not that it's hard, it was never designed to do this.

That is quite impressive for an auto Accord. Do you conduct classes to achieve such wonderful results? I truly would be interested. Quite a few friends at work own Accords and they usually just average in the high 20's. I was wondering if you can achieve that type of mileage with certain techniques at highway speeds. Thanks!! Jason B

What case is that? (It Might Actually work....)


Don

To get the milage Wayne gets on his Accord would require pulling out all stops and making no compromises. Very few people would agree to drive the way he does to get maximum FE in a car.

My hydroponics experiment

You ever notice how hard it is to lip read cartoon characters?
"Crazy is what the sane call Delta Flyer"

I'm glad to have missed out on a possible "holy war" between the HSD and IMA systems - kind of sounds like that oxymoron of "friendly fire".

That would be a huge upgrade! I do about 70% freeway driving overall on my Insight, but when gridlock happens, this would keep my fuel economy from sinking. I get lucky some of the time and get caught on the ramp on the Bush tollway going downhill and can slowly brake and coast.

I'd love to have a limited EV capability on my Insight. Can I ask for more? An auxilliary battery pack for city driving.

61.5mpg lifetime - 82mpg in recent months

Best Run >
www.cleanmpg.com

"fanatic" is what the lazy call the dedicated

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