339 HP Lexus GS Hybrid ??? - Page 11 - GreenHybrid

highlanderhybrid · #**101** (**permalink**) 03-20-2007, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimbop

This is a better article than most on the topic. They do a pretty good job of highlighting the main issues. However they still fall victim to the "economical payback" argument. Look at this tired old question:

"There's no denying that hybrids use less fuel than similar, gas-only vehicles, but are the fuel savings enough to make it a good financial move to buy one?"

When has popular mechanics, or any other such media source ever asked a question like this about ANY other upgrade? Consider this question:

"There's no denying that turbocharged, supercharged, or v8-upgraded vehicles get accelerate faster than their traditional counterparts, but is the time savings enough to make it a good financial move to buy one?"

Nope, I have never seen ANY media outlet, magazine, car show, etc ask a question like this about any other upgrade, including many that cost much more than a hybrid system. It proves that they just don't get it. There's more to hybrids than money savings and they can't be judged on that criteria alone, especially whan no other car upgrade is judged by that criteria ever.

As for the particular example of the Toyota Highlander:
That's great, and its nice to have that comparison from a reputable source, but imagine what kind of mileage it would get if it didn't have a power upgrade over the regular Highlander. Why must every vehicle continually come out with more and more power in each version? Evidentally at one point they thought the highlander had the right amount of power or they wouldn't have released it originally. So when they convert to hybrid, why the power boost too?

They claim 29mpg which seems pretty high compared to other numbers I have heard. The database shows 25/26, still more than 10% behind the Escape, which I would buy if I could stomach spending money on a Ford.

In any case 25-29 is pretty good mileage for an SUV - beats some of my Forester tanks - but it's still not a true economy SUV, which is what I would really like to see and I would buy in a heartbeat. I don't need extra power so I am still waiting for my model to come out. I want better than just "better MPG than it would get with a turbocharger or V8", I want truly the best MPG they can get with the power it actually needs (not the power people think they need). Yeah they think americans demand power, but the sales data and waiting lists for the HCH and prius disprove that every day. We don't have a real economy SUV yet so we don't know how it would sell, but I sure hope somebody gives us a chance to prove that we'd buy it if they made it.

On that note, where's the CRV hybrid they were promising anyway, wasn't that supposed to come out in 2006?

The Toyota Highlander Hybrid is much bigger than the Ford Escape and is way more powerfull than the Ford escape yet only suffers a 10% loss, thats awsome in my book.

zimbop · #**102** (**permalink**) 03-20-2007, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highlanderhybrid

The Toyota Highlander Hybrid is much bigger than the Ford Escape and is way more powerfull than the Ford escape yet only suffers a 10% loss, thats awsome in my book.

And this is the kind of thinking that keeps us on the wrong track IMO. There's always going to be something bigger and piggier out there, so these kinds of comparisons don't compel me. What I would like to see is some utility vehicle that squeezes as much efficiency out of a vehicle as possible, period. Not qualified by a comparison, or with some justification for added power or whatever. All vehicles on the road now have plenty of power, too much in most cases, I'm still waiting for the true economy SUV, so far they're all still putting power first, economy second.

jajohnson · #**103** (**permalink**) 03-20-2007, 11:40 AM

Zimbop

My sentiments exactly. The HiHy is just big enough to carry what I need, powerful enough to tow what I have to tow, and gets better fuel economy than many compact and subcompact cars around town. All in all, the most environmentally friendly car that fills all my needs and is truly economical.

highlanderhybrid · #**104** (**permalink**) 03-20-2007, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimbop

And this is the kind of thinking that keeps us on the wrong track IMO. There's always going to be something bigger and piggier out there, so these kinds of comparisons don't compel me. What I would like to see is some utility vehicle that squeezes as much efficiency out of a vehicle as possible, period. Not qualified by a comparison, or with some justification for added power or whatever. All vehicles on the road now have plenty of power, too much in most cases, I'm still waiting for the true economy SUV, so far they're all still putting power first, economy second.

Umm this is very economical for me. I was coming from a Chevrolet Tahoe with a 5.3 Liter V8 that got 13 MPG and now I have an SUV that I can still fit my kids in and their friends and tow our 4-wheelers and yet get around 30 MPG overall I think it's pretty good.

zimbop · #**105** (**permalink**) 03-21-2007, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highlanderhybrid

Umm this is very economical for me. I was coming from a Chevrolet Tahoe with a 5.3 Liter V8 that got 13 MPG and now I have an SUV that I can still fit my kids in and their friends and tow our 4-wheelers and yet get around 30 MPG overall I think it's pretty good.

For you this does look like a great improvement. I'm just disappointed when, at every step, they add power. Without that power boost you might do even better and still have plenty of get-up-and-go. The Sprinter van was one such example (though new for this year guess what... more power), but a van doesn't work well for me, it would have been great before I quit contracting work, but as for a medium suv I think they can do much better if they cut back on the power gains and put it into efficiency. How about one of these with a small diesel like they make in every other country but here. A little 2.5 or 2.8 that could burn biodiesel and be very friendly on the environment and geopolitics. They just won't give us a chance to show them we want it. The jeep liberty was a pathetic attempt at that (250HP is an awful waste) and it didn't work because it was hardly more efficient than the gas version.

soulrobber · #**106** (**permalink**) 07-06-2007, 06:30 AM

my 2 cents... i have a camry hybrid. if i was poorer id probably get the prius hybrid. if i was richer, id probably get the GS hybrid.

hybrids are meant to be fuel efficient, and now you can be fuel efficient with almost whatever preference of car you like to drive. its not meant to, altough its a nice bonus for some hybrids, save as much gas as possible while moving you from point A to point B. that is the insight/prius's job.

bar10dah · #**107** (**permalink**) 09-17-2007, 11:16 AM

I just saw one of these on the road this past weekend. It was a test car. I got a snap of it with my cameraphone, but it's very low resolution. I'll try to post it when I get a chance to move the pic from my phone to my computer. Overall, I'm not impressed with the exterior. I'd much rather buy the Camry over the GS. Especially for the price tag on the GS!

On a plus side, looking into the car, looks like it's plenty roomy and comfortable to ride in!

tigerhonaker · #**108** (**permalink**) 09-28-2007, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bar10dah

I just saw one of these on the road this past weekend. It was a test car. I got a snap of it with my cameraphone, but it's very low resolution. I'll try to post it when I get a chance to move the pic from my phone to my computer. Overall, I'm not impressed with the exterior. I'd much rather buy the Camry over the GS. Especially for the price tag on the GS!

On a plus side, looking into the car, looks like it's plenty roomy and comfortable to ride in!

Hi Keith,

If I still had the income I use to have I would have [Purchased] one of these instead of the Accord Hybrid that I did "Purchase" and think it is a Great Car for the money.

I have ridden and [Driven] the Lexus 450h and I can tell you that thing really Rocks. Nice inside also. Very Plush.

Got to have money though it is IMO "Expensive".

Keith if you get the opportunity drive this Hybrid it is the {MACHINE} !!!!