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CORTE MADERA, Calif., Jul. 2, 2007 (KGO) - A Marin County woman loves her new car, except for one major problem. It can't always make it up the steep hill her home sits on. She's now fighting to get her money back.
Jennifer Liebeler owns a 2006 Honda Civic Hybrid. She took us on a ride so we could see her problem for ourself.
Jennifer describes driving her Honda Civic Hybrid up a Corte Madera hillside.
Jennifer Liebeler: "The accelerator's floored. It looks like I'm going to be able to get up, maybe. The accelerator's completely floored. I don't know if you can tell, but it's all the way floored and the car is not driving up the hill."
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From what I know about HCH (not very much,) it sounds like one car in particular. In fact, I would have expected the HCH to be relatively immune. If a Prius has a low battery, it really slows down going up a hill.
What a loser! Stories like that really drive me nuts. If she wasn't able to get a pick-up up the hill it wouldn't be newsworthy, but since it's a hybrid then the biased press gloms on to it like crazy. And of course, it's the American way to sue to get your way. The worst part is that Honda is getting bad press over this.
I've never found a hill that my HCH can't summit...
Commuter car, grocery getter, and summer road tripper--average 10k miles per year.
Winter road trips and ski trips, bad weather commuter and my wife's "daily" driver--expected average 4k miles per year.
From what I know about HCH (not very much,) it sounds like one car in particular. In fact, I would have expected the HCH to be relatively immune. If a Prius has a low battery, it really slows down going up a hill.
Nah, there have been numerous owner reports in this very forum about the transformation the HCH-II goes through when the battery is "out". The 1.3 liter engine when operating alone turns the car into an anemic performer, which is often unexpected by some new owners.
This lady may have gotten a lemon, perhaps.
But depending on how steep the climb is, I find it plausible that the car will be unable to make it up there without a good SoC. Without the IMA, the HCH-II is really underpowered.
That is the part that has me wondering what is going on. I would expect the HCH II to just rev the engine up a bit more. I'm wondering if she may have a defective CVT that is internally slipping.
Nah, there have been numerous owner reports in this very forum about the transformation the HCH-II goes through when the battery is "out". The 1.3 liter engine when operating alone turns the car into an anemic performer, which is often unexpected by some new owners.
This lady may have gotten a lemon, perhaps.
But depending on how steep the climb is, I find it plausible that the car will be unable to make it up there without a good SoC. Without the IMA, the HCH-II is really underpowered.
Cheers;
MSantos
I don't buy it. How often does your HCH get down to the point where there is no SoC? Even on extended mountain drives where I'm on continuous climbs I've never seen it go flat (1 bar maybe but never flat). Unless her house is 2000 feet above her office/shopping/whatever, I find it very unlikely that she has zero charge and the motor will kick in on acceleration even at next to no charge.
Besides, even when the battery has next to no juice, the CVT revs the engine higher and the power is enough to get over Eisenhower tunnel (11,000 feet) at ~50mph.
Commuter car, grocery getter, and summer road tripper--average 10k miles per year.
Winter road trips and ski trips, bad weather commuter and my wife's "daily" driver--expected average 4k miles per year.
That is the part that has me wondering what is going on. I would expect the HCH II to just rev the engine up a bit more. I'm wondering if she may have a defective CVT that is internally slipping.
The probability of slippage was higher with the HCH-1. Given the updated design and measures taken for the HCH-II CVT, it is very unlikely that there is any measurable slippage occurring in this case. Mostly because the system would have detected the slippage and would have generated the appropriate codes.
It is implied from the news item that the dealership "looked" at the issue and uncovered no malfunction.
It could also be that there is a malfunction on the throttle control switch/module... since the revs never went as high as 6000+. Since it is a drive-by-wire the HCH-II is not immune to that, however for such a new unit, I find that possibility interesting.
Hybrids: 2006 Honda Civic Hybrid, 2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid
Posts: 709
Re: Lemon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kristian
I don't buy it. How often does your HCH get down to the point where there is no SoC? Even on extended mountain drives where I'm on continuous climbs I've never seen it go flat (1 bar maybe but never flat). Unless her house is 2000 feet above her office/shopping/whatever, I find it very unlikely that she has zero charge and the motor will kick in on acceleration even at next to no charge.
Besides, even when the battery has next to no juice, the CVT revs the engine higher and the power is enough to get over Eisenhower tunnel (11,000 feet) at ~50mph.
I agree. Even without the electric motor the ICE is capable of 93 hp. I've driven back and forth through that tunnel as well with no problems.
I don't buy it. How often does your HCH get down to the point where there is no SoC? Even on extended mountain drives where I'm on continuous climbs I've never seen it go flat (1 bar maybe but never flat). Unless her house is 2000 feet above her office/shopping/whatever, I find it very unlikely that she has zero charge and the motor will kick in on acceleration even at next to no charge.
Besides, even when the battery has next to no juice, the CVT revs the engine higher and the power is enough to get over Eisenhower tunnel (11,000 feet) at ~50mph.
Good point;
My SoC never really went below 2 pips. But even during those rare times that it did (very hot and operating on AC as an example), the assist was gone until the SoC returned to at least 4 pips or better.
In actuality, some of us have been deprived of IMA assist under certain situations (too hot, too cold, etc, etc) and the little engine really huffs and puffs hard, almost seeming like it will take forever to anything normal.
Additionally, the news article mentioned the lack of SoC as a visual attribute of the failed climbing attempt.
If you watch the video, it doesn't appear that she even gets past 3000 RPM. Something is definitely wrong with her car. As an aside, check out the video at about 1:20 in, her driver's side door and front bumper appear kind of banged up. Perhaps an indication of the level of car maintenance? Probably not but just thought it was interesting.
Hybrids: '06 Civic Hybrid Magnetic Pearl w/Navi (as of July 1, 2006)
Posts: 1,124
Re: Lemon?
If the car in that video was being FLOORED, then it was being starved of GAS. It never even got to 3500 RPM. Was she in first gear or something? The car was moving SO slow - or so it appeared. She should take the car to another dealer for advice.
Ty, I DID notice the left front bumper crunch and driver side door dents. Maybe someone ELSE should try driving this car up that hill!
Steve
STOP terrorism - Drive a HYBRID
Vehicles:
350 miles a week ------------ 2006 HCH II, Magnetic Pearl, w/NAVI (born on May 25, 2006)
350 miles a month ---------- 2003 Mazda Tribute ES-V6
350 miles a year (for now) - 1986 Mercedes 560SL
Lemon?
