Disgusted is right-real life average drivers get about 20 mpg city, but they can get close to the 28mpg hy in pure trip driving(gas station to gas station on the interstates) on the interstate at 65mph or so.
Huskerforthespurs-CR got 16-28 for the hybrid,and 13-25 non hybrid-about 3 mpg.They do drive a hard city loop, but for a "normal driver" 3-4 mpg better in the city is about right.You really have to keep your speed down to about 65mph to get the 28mpg highway, but it can be done easily at 60-65.
Folks here don't like CR because they don't "like" the objectively arrived at numbers , since they don't agree with their preconceived ideas.The forum numbers are EXTREMELY BIASED.,and not controlled in any way.CR numbers are reproducible-just follow their protocol,and you will get their numbers.Where is the protocol on the forum?
There are no "average" drivers on this site.No way can an average driver get 5-7 mpg more with the HH or 400.The24- 25mpg average on this forum is not from "normal" drivers,and it has lots of interstate and city interstate mixed in.
Charlie

Toyota/Lexus is not screwing anyone ... the old method for deriving fuel economies was totally the govt's doing, not Toyota's (or any car makers fault).

For 2008 new testing standards having taken effect and the 400h will be 27 mpg city, 25 mpg highway VS the RX 350's 17 city, 22 highway.

I'm sorry you are not happy.

Before I bought my Camry Hybrid I was thinking of buying a Prius. As with any big purchase I did a little research. It was hardly a secret that most people weren't getting the EPA numbers.

At the time the Prius was rated at 60/51. Many people were getting 45-47. When I bought my Camry it was rated at 40/38. Using the Prius numbers as a guide I figured I'd get 34 or so.

As mentioned, the government forces Toyota to put THE EPA numbers on the vehicle. Toyota cannot legally supply any other fuel economy numbers.

As we all know the EPA changed their test to better simulate driving in the 21st century. With that:

Prius - 46 MPG combined. (exactly what most people get)
Camry - 34 MPG combined (right on my guess, and what most TCH owners are getting)
High 4WD - 26 combined. (your 25 is within a few %)


As far as resale value. Your numbers sound typical. In fact they are probably good. The next generation vehicle is just hitting the docks. Similar price, new vechicle, more features. All vehicles depreciate very quickly.

Toyota can't legally supply any other FE numbers?Is that true? I have been given magazine writeups-that contain 0-60 #'s and FE numbers -as part of the sales pitch in various dealerships.The writeups are professionally copied-not something done on the office copy machine,so I suspect the manufacturer must be ok with it.
Charlie
With the Prius We get about 41 mpg in pure city driving(lots of short trips with a cold motor) with the Prius-about 49mpg pure highway at 65 mph or so.The new EPA numbers aren't bad-real life the highway beats the city -the tiny 4 cyl,and the low drag account for that.

I'll admit that there is a difference between the computerized average that I've gotten (30.7 so far) versus my real numbers (29.1), but I also know that my odometer is tracking about 10% less than actual which affects both calculations. Have I reached 31+ (actual) on a single tank? Yes, many times. The worst actual number I've gotten so far on a tank? 26.5. For me, my experience is well in line with the MPG estimates I was given.

What part of this portion of my post did you not understand?

"(All nay-sayers please look at the FE charts on THIS VERY SITE rather than reply that one day in october of 2007 you got 300+ MPG. We're not buying it any more)."

Why EXACTLY did you think the government was making them do NEW testing? Yes, EXACTLY, it WAS/IS the public uproar of the prior "suspect" numbers. IMHO, it IS Toyota's issue as they facilitated the falicy

Unfortunately, I do dis-agree with this statement. In city driving for us IS in line with the numbers listed on this side (25 to 26 MPG). That IS what we (and most others got). Most people DO drive a mix of city and highway. Not certain where (or who) you state is gettign 20MPG but if they are, then they DO have other issues (like oil levels or the ECU programming outlined in other threads).

I'm not sure I follow what you're saying with "what part of this...". My comment was that the gov't revised estimates are in line with what I expected to see, with what my research showed was possible/likely to occur, and are what my actual driving numbers reflect.

You said that in your 2006 HiHy, "the BEST they seem to AVERAGE is around 25MPG no matter HOW you drive them". While my averages are nowhere close to Mr Kite's numbers, all I can offer is that my driving - no matter whether I drive city or hwy, with the A/C on or off - results in averages that are higher than the 25MPG you're claiming.

What I don't understand is your comment "it IS Toyota's issue as they facilitated the falicy", when the MPG sticker is a gov't regulation outside of all automakers' control. For more information on what the government says needs to be on the sticker itself, you might want to check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monroney_sticker. For info on how the gov't does its estimates, check out either fueleconomy.gov or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_ec...nt_regulations

Hope that helps!

This is "Mr. Kites" tank average. From http://www.greenhybrid.com/discuss/f...hlander-14849/

This hardly a one day "downhill the whole way" trip.

FE depends on the driver and the route. First. Mr. Kite seems to be a good driver. And he drives on a back road route to stay in the magic zone of the vehicle. And his trips look to be at least 30 min.

Yes, most people aren't willing to learn to drive the vehicle. And most aren't willing to change their route to drive slower and smoother. And most don't get 40 MPG either...