The 12 volt battery died yesterday. I drove to work normally and parked. When I hopped in to go home, the car would not start and the instruments dimmed and became largely inoperative after the normal key-on light show. A friend gave me a hand push, and the car started easily (manual transmission). The 13 mile drive home was rough and the only instrument that seemed to work was the speedometer. Assist was dead. A check at several auto parts stores indicated that the battery was a dealer only item. While they had batteries that would work, they were longer and heavier.

So, off to Honda I went. Sure enough, the parts book showed the original small, light battery. However, when the parts gent brought it out, it was a longer, heavier unit (Civic-sized) just like the discount auto parts stores had. I confirmed that the part number was correct. So, Honda has switched the lighter battery out for a cheaper high-volume unit that wipes out a good bit of the fine engineering they did with the aluminum suspension and brake parts.

This is the first shady practice I've seen from Honda since I got my Insight. I wonder what the additional 25 pounds or so would do to DOT fuel efficiency ratings? Shame on you Honda. I went to NAPA and bought their battery for $20 less than Honda's. I'm annoyed and will try to find a smaller unit that will meet the car's original design spec. Perhaps at a Suzuki motorcycle store?

 

I highly recommend checking the 12-volt battery every six months.

While mine lasted 3.5 years, I had a couple of weekends that the Insight was totally DEAD. Last thing you want is the hybrid battery going dead trying to rescue a $75 12-volt battery.

The replacement was half the size of a typical car battery - more like the riding lawn mower type.

 

I had a similar experience where the car needed to be push started and the electrical accessories got dimmer and dimmer on the way home. It was dangerous towards the end with extremely dim headlights but I managed to barely make it home. The next day I replaced it with a larger unit, and was glad to do so. The battery was only 3.5 years old, with 20k miles on it.

When this black box battery dies, I will replace it with a lower weight, greater capacity, and more modern battery. The Honda Hybrid Yahoo group has an enormous amount of discussion about the 12v battery.

 

Are you guys experiencing this 12 volt battery failure problem after coasting in reboot mode frequently or for long distances and/or periods of time.

I have had near death 12 volt battery experiences several times in my HCH. When I coast with the engine off, it seems the IMA's battery back pack is not connected to the 12 volt, so the 12 volt is on its own to power the car's electrical and electronic equipment (the 12 volt seems connected and to benefit from the charge in the IMA battery back pack during normal driving, regenerative driving, and even during auto-stop mode). This problem is only made worse when I coast with the engine off at night, and the 12 volt has head and tail lights to deal with also. But I haven't replaced my 12 volt yet (15 months and 31,000 miles old).

When you get to the point that the lights are dimming and the electronics start to fail, and the IMA shuts down, even when the car is running, it seems that the 12 volt's charge is so low that it cannot maintain a connection with the IMA battery back pack. It is then only a matter of time before the battery gets so low that the car will not run, or start.

I have found that the simple solution is the good old fashioned jump start with jumper cables to another car. The other car's battery will provide enought juice to start, and to reconnect the IMA to the battery, and then the car runs fine and everything works. Of course, if the battery is that low, then my reboot coasting is done for the night, and I drive normally to give the ICE and IMA a chance to put a real recharge back into the 12 volt battery. I have even started plugging my 12 volt into a battery charger at night at home, to try to get the battery a chance to be up to snuff of rhte next day's workout.

In the end, I think the real solution is to replace the factory battery with something more powerful, maybe bigger, but hopefully not too much heavier.

 

The aluminum helps the car weigh about 1000 pounds less than a regular car. 25lbs do not make a difference. Are you anorexic as well in order to maximize FE? Because peoples' weights vary by alot more than 25lbs.

 

....sort of related, Lance Armstrong has lost as much as 20 pounds during a year prior to a Tour de France Race.

Now speak of a hyper-miler mentality! If a cyclist was ahead of him on one of the twenty stages of the race, he would often save energy and let them win that stage. Only if it was someone in the top ten overall standings might he challenge them.

He spent hours in a wind tunnel to determing the most aerodynamic position and still deliver a power stroke. His nutrition and bike were scrutinized for every possible advantage.

While Lance avoided speculating how history will judge his seven consecutive Tour de France victories, he did boast that he and his trainer changed forever how the race is played doing all of the above.

 

I had never done any reboots up until the time it failed. Before I bought the car it sat around for a year or so, unused in Michigan.

Having ground cables in the trunk is a great idea, thanks for mentioning it.

 

I have a voltmeter gauge in my car that I keep an eye on. If the car battery gets to around 11.6 I start to consider turning on the engine. I have yet to see it drop to 11.5 but if it did thats the point where I would turn on the car for a charge.

I mostly drive with reboots during the day so I don't have the load of the lights or anything.

P.S. I have a very large aftermarket battery so the voltage may stay up higher longer for me.