Hello All,

As you can see this is my first of hopefully many future posts. I am usually an active member of the community to whatever car I currently have so hopefully can contribute more down the road.

Well I recently purchased a 2008 Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid with 96k miles on it that I got for 20,500. Its dark khaki with black interior with brand new wrangler tires. I have been driving it for about 2 weeks out of the 4 weeks I have to exchange it. I love the car so far, but need some advice.

So like I said I have two weeks left to exchange the car for whatever reason with my local dealer here in MN. This thing has been great with all the snow, ice and cold weather we've had. I came from a 2007 Acura MDX sport with 160k miles. I am a salesman that drives 20k a year so high mileage cars are usually no worry for me and besides a couple 98 silverados I had in high school I have recently only had imports.

Well fast forward to the questions. So a couple things have popped up lately, and granted i may just be a perfectionist or paranoid because of the things ive read but want to make sure I do my research before I decide to keep this baby for the long hall. If I am just being paranoid please just tell me so

Heres the laundry list-

1. The night I purchased the vehicle, i came roaring into my driveway and slammed on the brakes, they didnt give out like some people reported with previous issues that were software related but the stabilitrak and park assist lights popped up after I did that. A simple restart fixed that and before purchasing the vehicle I read that a new battery is a good idea so I made them put one in a couple days later following the incident. No problems since. I am going in for a hybrid and transmission software update tomorrow (which i also included in the deal). Did the software program fix most of the issues where the brakes would go out to just hydraulic or is this an ongoing issue?

2.I had a service light pop up that turned out to be a o2 sensor that they replaced for free probably triggered by the -20 degree weather.

3.The engine seems to be pretty smooth, but sitting at idle you can occasionally feel it sputter (very very minor sputter). I am not too worried about it especially since the sputter you feel cant be detected on the tach and it seems very suttle, but I know these engines have had a couple issues with rockers and bad cylinders that resulted in replaced engines. Does this sound related to any of those issues? This could be me being paranoid as the shutter is very very small, barely detectable. Just want to see if this could be normal. Also while in park if I slam the gas it peaks around 4k rpms and comes back down. With the tach going up to 6k rpms (assuming it redlines around 5k rpms) I thought this would go higher.

4. Maybe I just have to get used to it, but starting the car just sounds rough. I will crank it and it starts right up, so no issues there but its not a normal engine sound. Its kind of like a gas go cart if that makes sense. Is that normal? I think what im asking is it normal that this vehicle sounds different than a normal tahoe while starting? I am hoping this is just a hybrid sound attributed to a different starter for that auto start/stop.

5) The EV mode really only works up to 15mph for me but I have been known to have a lead foot and also its been very very cold in MN recently so half the time it takes a good while for the EV and auto stop to work. If i get going to 30 on the gas engine and then let off sometimes I can kick it back into EV. I just mainly want to make sure thats not a sign of a bad 300v battery. Speaking of, what are the signs?

Overall I have had a great time with this car and am tempted to keep it. But for every good review I have spotted theres another horrible review. So I am leaning on you guys a little bit to give me your overall feel on this vehicles reliability. It is overall very clean and fits me and my lifestyle very well and has gotten me 18.5 mpg in the city (cold winter right now, hoping for closer to 20 in the summer) and 22 on the highway. So that part I like. The only negative besides what I mentioned above is carfax did show one accident which affected a quarter panel. Service records showed that a quarter panel and front bumper were replaced. It still has a clean title.

So my timeline is getting the hybrid and transmission firmware updated tomorrow and then by next week I have to decide to keep this or go with a 2009 Toureg TDI they just got in with 90k which would be an even swap. I want to keep the Hybrid, but I am looking for a little reassurance from you guys who at this point are the experts.

Sorry for the long winded post.

 

Do you have the 4wd Tahoe hybrid? The engine sounds need getting used to. The on and off engine is usually smooth but for somebody used to gas, it is unnerving. The AFM of the LFA engine is way more advanced than the VCM of acuras and Hondas. Follow my posts about my escalade hybrid and you will see that this brute is a beast.

 

Thanks for the response!

Yes it's the 4WD model.

Just had the transmission update which killed my mileage and seemed to auto stop a lot less. I am thinking it's because the update made my TCU learn again or maybe the 300v battery was low.

Also I noticed that my 12 battery is sitting around 13-14 now where as before the update it was 14-15 always.

I have seen a couple guys say they can get to 30mph all on electric. The max I have seen is 20mph and it took a while. Usually it only gets to 10-15mph before switching on the engine. Is this a red flag concerning the 300v at all?

Lastly the service manager said cylinder 1 and 4 popped a "lean" code. he said it's probably nothing but he wanted to hand clean all the injectors and put in seafoam. He also said bank 2 O2 sensor may need to be replaced. I told him I'll run seafoam first and come back if I have any issues. Are these codes similar to the people who had their engines replaced by GM?

This guy who helped me was the Cadillac dealers version of a hybrid tech. It was a cadillac dealer that had a tech who owned a 2010 escalade hybrid and had some GM hybrid training. But I'm pretty sure he wasn't hybrid certified, just more familiar, so I'm unsure how good his advice is. He said it's really clean and wouldn't worry to much about it. He also found out GM replaced the transfer case and tranny 2 years ago.

The dealer is apart of the family of dealers where I bought the car so I'm unsure how legit their advice is. Of course they want me to keep it.

 

Sea Foam... NO way. If you want to clean fuel injectors use ONLY Chevron Techron. Add a little more "stiff" than the label and it will work in minutes.

You are saying 20 degrees outside... F?

Don't obsess about electric maximum speed, it is highly dependent on your right foot and the HV battery power limits at that instant. Your decsriptions sound "normal".

It’s mostly your foot. To accelerate a 3-ton SUV requires lots of power. To accelerate from zero to a maximum of roughly 28 MPH will take a flat road, a very light foot, and nobody behind you. For quite a while.

It would take a long distance maybe up to ¼ mile and practice. Lots of practice.
Why?
Power limits. Here are some factors that influence power limits on NiMh battery chemistry.
Battery cell temperatures, a little colder than 50F battery and you won’t have maximum limits. Hotter than 95F and you won’t have maximum limits available. The HV battery should give you maximum available power in kilowatts in between those temperatures and within “normal” charged values.

When the truck sits outside for more than 10 hours in the cold, it may take an hour to get it warm enough for Auto-Stop. Just because it goes into Auto-Stop does not mean you have full power available.
In near zero F it could be a couple hours depending on the settings on the cabin heat. Likewise if fully warm in winter such as a 20 hour drive Detroit to Denver, it won’t cool fast.

Next is your 12V system voltage. Immediately after start it should go as high as 15. With headlights, wipers, and defroster on HIGH = 14-15V

Any one of those three alone will cause the Body Control Module to request higher 12V system voltage. If the BCM thinks the 12V battery is fully charged AND those accessory loads are OFF or low, the system voltage will lower and go into a "fuel Economy" mode, thus reducing system voltge and POWER.

Power = V^2/R and the truck acts like a resistor to changes in system voltage.

BTW, Non-Hybrid GM products do this too.

 

@Pelov008 Did you keep the Hybrid?

Do any of you guys know if there is a way to know if a dealer is "Hybrid Certified" other than just asking the dealer? Maybe a list or something from GM?

The Battery/Hybrid systems are warrantied to 8 Years / 100k miles right? Thanks!

 

Yes battery and hybrid components up to 8 years/100k miles. If you go to GM.com, there is usually a hybrid icon beside the name of the dealer which means they can service hybrids. If not, your local dealer can guide you to the proper channels. What location are you in?

 

I am in Baton Rouge, LA.

 

Maybe hillbilly_hybrid can give some suggested dealers?

 

Well... That was fun. I just engaged GM in a chat to see if they could tell me which dealers in my area have hybrid trained technicians or are "Hybrid Certified". I didn't really get anywhere. Conversation listed below

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Ryan [1:01 PM]: Chevrolet - Question/concern about a vehicle I own
System [1:01 PM]: Connection established.
System [1:01 PM]: Thank you for your patience. We are currently assisting other customers. You will
be connected to the next available agent.
System [1:01 PM]: Welcome to Chevrolet
System [1:01 PM]: www.chevrolet.com
System [1:12 PM]: Connectingâ¦A live chat agent is now entering the chat.
System [1:12 PM]: Welcome to chat.
Rachel [1:12 PM]: Thank you for chatting in with Chevrolet Customer Assistance, How may I assist
you?
Ryan [1:15 PM]: hello
Ryan [1:15 PM]: i own a 2009 chevy tahoe hybrid
Ryan [1:15 PM]: I would like to find the nearest dealer that is "hybrid certified"
Ryan [1:15 PM]: can you help me find one?
Rachel [1:16 PM]: Have you contacted any dealers in your area?
Ryan [1:18 PM]: no
Rachel [1:18 PM]: May I please have you zip code?
Ryan [1:19 PM]: 70815
Rachel [1:19 PM]: Thank you. Please allow me a moment.
Ryan [1:19 PM]: ok
Rachel [1:23 PM]: Thank you for patiently waiting, I did reach out to Brian Harris Chevrolet, looks to
be 3 miles away from the zip code you provided me. Location is 15015 Florida BLVD, Baton Rouge,
LA. They can be contacted at (225) 272-6500. They do service hybrid vehicle's. Would this dealership
work for you?
Ryan [1:24 PM]: my question is not whether they will service them or not, my question is
more along the lines of what dealer may be certified to do so? By certified, I mean trained by GM
Rachel [1:26 PM]: Any GM dealership is a certified by GM . Brian Harris is certified by GM and also
is certified in hybrid.
Ryan [1:27 PM]: ok. how can you tell if they are hybrid certified, just curious? do you have
a list?
Rachel [1:28 PM]: Unfortunately I do not just have a list of which one's are certified. I reached out to
dealership in your local area and located Brian Harris.
Ryan [1:29 PM]: well, i don't want to be difficult, I just wish to obtain neccessary
information. Since Hybrid systems are vastly different than other vehicle systems, I want to make sure
the dealer I bring it to is trained to work on hybrids in particular.
Ryan [1:30 PM]: and you don't have a list
Ryan [1:30 PM]: so....
Ryan [1:30 PM]: can you get me to someone who might be able to help me find out the
information i seek?
Rachel [1:32 PM]: I did reach out to different dealerships in your area, I did locate Brian Harris viaphone directly to their service department to see if they were certified in hybrid. Not all dealership's
are criticized.
Rachel [1:32 PM]: certified*
Rachel [1:34 PM]: I can provide you with a list of dealerships in your local area if you would like to
reach out to them personally.
Ryan [1:34 PM]: I appreciate your input, but I am not sure I want to take the dealership
clerk's second hand assertion that they are certified. Is this the best information I can get? Certainly
Chevy must keep track of those that are certified.
Ryan [1:36 PM]: Would you mind escalating this query since I don't feel like my question
has been answered satifactorily?
Rachel [1:36 PM]: We do not keep that information, dealerships are individually owned and operated,
It is on their behalf to be certified in hybrid technicians work there.
Rachel [1:36 PM]: Unfortunately at this time there would be no one to escalate this to. I am in the
best possibly position to process your request.
Ryan [1:39 PM]: Ok. This transcription is going to the Hybrid forums, as well as Chevy's
social media page.
The answer I wanted to obtain was simply a list of local GM dealers that have Hybrid certified
technicians. I haven't received that today. Finding a list of dealers is quite easy, so your answer
wasn't really what I hoped to get.
What I got from this conversation is
-There is a dealer 3 mi away + contact info
Rachel [1:41 PM]: Okay, Is there anything else I can assist you with today?
Ryan [1:41 PM]: no
Rachel [1:41 PM]: Thank you for chatting in with us, Have a wonderful day!
System [1:41 PM]: You have been disconnected from the chat session. If you require further
assistance, please start another chat session.

 

There is no such thing as a GM "Hybrid Certified" specific dealership per se. So you started off asking a question that the phone person had no clue how to answer.

There are dealers who want NOTHING to do with hybrids. Too many!

There are dealers who will tell you they have an "expert" in hybrids and they don't. Ask evois.

There are dealerships with stellar techs that learn and adapt fast. But somehow they are never recognized by the institution or their Service Managers.

There is NO official list of any of these.

Asking GM to find you a great dealer willing and able to do a deep dive into your hybrid would be like calling Ford and asking for a dealership with an "expert" in late 1970s Variable Venturi carburetor. Or an expert on Corvair engines.

I am one of those. BTW.

GM keeps track of techs that take the "training" . Being "trained" and competent are different things. Lots of years have taught me that.

What specifically are you looking for?

The person you need to get ahold of is a Regional Service Engineer. They may be candid enough to steer you toward a very competent dealership. However, you will have to get some dealership service department to give you their number.

Or you could call several "suggested" dealers. Ask for the Service Manager and have a frank and candid discussion with them about their hybrid tech capabilites.

You need a tech that will use the Tech 2 or the newer MDI to "plug in" and take data on the various sub systems. You need a tech that is comfortable and WILLING to take that data and maybe even provide you with a plotted copy of it. All dealers have this capability.

Most don't know how or WON'T.

Dealers get paid to change parts. Every part change has a code and a time allotted. So you may be on the hook for $100/hour to have a great tech indulge you in what ever you are looking for.