My "blended fuel" would cost:

1.75 x $2.329 + 13.25 x $2.899 / 15 = $2.8325 per gallon

So going from E10 to E20 is like getting a coupon for 7 cents off per gallon. 7 x 15 = $1.05 savings per tank. That buys a bottle of pop or bag of chips!

Hard to say what the "real" cost was due to the bitter cold and snow.
I think it was 2 MPG less than normal... so that means I lost 30 miles, or about 1 gallon worth. Net loss... probably... but this was only the first tank and I drove all the miles in 1 day, so maybe the LTFT tables that Gary speaks of have not "adjusted" yet.
I still say you score one for the planet, even getting 30 miles less per tank and only saving $1. in the process.

I think moving towards ethanol is a small step. A small step indeed, but in the right direction.
And I feel a small step is better than no step at all.

 

Sioux Falls, SD

 

The vehicles used were:

Four 2007 vehicles, with automatic transmissions:

•

•

•

•

 

Has anyone here converted their hybrid to run on e85?

 

To my knowledge no one has converted one, but Ford has built 20 and place them in areas that sell E85 so the EPA can test.

GaryG

 

Exerpts from Ethanol Producer Magazine, November, 2007.

In Sioux Falls, S.D., Lisa Richardson tells EPM that blender pumps are an exciting marketing opportunity for ethanol. "[Ethanol] is too cheap right now, but that means there are some good margins for blenders out there, and a chance to use more ethanol," she says. "We're making more ethanol than there is a demand for. We are going to have a crash in this industry if we don't do more on the marketing and sales sides." In late September, ACE accused oil companies of not passing on savings as a result of record low ethanol prices to consumers. Many oil companies today are purchasing ethanol at bargain prices, but in an apparent attempt to discourage the use of ethanol, they are offering ethanol blends at excessive prices to their dealer stations, ACE wrote in a letter to top Congressional leaders. In other instances, refiners are purchasing low-priced ethanol, and adding unfair profit by marking up the price of ethanol-blended fuel, and making motorists pay more at the pump. In these cases, sales of ethanol are artificially depressed at a time when more ethanol would lower prices for consumers.

Dispelling the Mid-Range Myth
Surprisingly, there is no definitive science behind the selection of E10 as an acceptable blend for nonflexible-fuel vehicles. "We really don't know what that optimum blend is," Richardson says. "The 10 percent number was only the result of a deal cut with the oil companies." The U.S. EPA approved 20 percent and 30 percent blends for use in the beginning of 2007. "All the feedback has been positive … there've been no issues whatsoever," he says. The cooperative is not, however, recommending the use of E30 or E85 in standard vehicles. The hoses for E30 and E85 are yellow, while the hoses for unleaded and E10 are black. Therefore, it's very clear to the customer which product they're putting in their tanks. While official statements from blender pump operators in South Dakota maintain that E30 is specifically for FFV use, French says he's heard no complaints from customers who use it in standard-fuel-component vehicles. "We have to get rid of this myth that you can only burn a blend of up to 10 percent if you don't have a flex-fuel vehicle (FFV),” Anderson says. He blames the auto companies for this wide misconception. "They've done some things to help ethanol, but they also want to sell you a new [flexible-fuel] car," he says. "Not everybody can afford to buy a new FFV, but that doesn't mean you can't burn higher blends. I use 40 percent in my car, 75 percent in my truck, and I have no idea what they mean when they talk about corrosion and some of these other things. My vehicles will be running longer than anybody else's."

 

So the American Coalition for Ethanol says it's better to use more ethanol, huh? Imagine that.

I'd really like to see more independent research to support their research. I'm sure the Dairy Producers of America have reports that say drinking more milk is better too. Until the AMA, FDA or some other independent group agrees (through research), I'm going to remain a little sceptical.

I'm not saying that more Ethanol is better or worse, just that I don't necessarily trust these types of reports for full face value.

 

I see your point, but the U.S. EPA also says more ethanol is cleaner for the environment. And I also "believe it when I see it" and I know E10 is not a good blend for the Ford Escape Hybrid.

I have tested one tank of E20 with no ill effects, and the car ran well, with only a slight reduction in MPG... so I am really hopeful that E30 will be a "sweet spot" and have better results than E10 in my car.

With 1000 different models of internal combustion engines on the road today, no blanket statement is going to cover them all.
-John

 

John what is required to blend ethanol with gasoline, is there some kind of additive that allows them to mix?

 

They mix very well on their own.
Once mixed, they cannot be separated, without going through the whole distillation process.

You can add 1 or 2 gallons of E85 to 10 gallons of plain gas whenever you like. I like to add a little gas, then a little E85, and then top off with regular gas, just so there is initial physical mixing inside my tank.
Chemically, they mix perfectly by themselves.

This is exactly what the gas station does.
Ethanol is sold, and transported in the form of E95 actually.
The E95 is sold and transported with a trivial amount ( 0.001% ) of corrosion (rust) inhibitor in it already.
Then the station owner adds 10% of their own gas, either right at the pump, or at the tank to make E85. The E85 is "approximately" 85% ethanol, but it is not an exact science and can be off a little.

FYI here is a data table:

Blend, Reid Vapor Pressure, Specific Gravity

Gasoline 9.07 0.7404