Steve-- Your amazingly high MPG
#1
02-06-2011, 04:24 PM
Steve-- Your amazingly high MPG
Hi Steve,
I am considering getting a Honda Hybrid and what to know how you get such great gas mileage. I'm also a little worried about the hybrid battery of a Honda Civic Hybrid as I have seen posts by some pretty unhappy people ehre about defective batteries that Honda doesn't want to acknowledge.
Right now, I'm still unsure about it.
I am considering getting a Honda Hybrid and what to know how you get such great gas mileage. I'm also a little worried about the hybrid battery of a Honda Civic Hybrid as I have seen posts by some pretty unhappy people ehre about defective batteries that Honda doesn't want to acknowledge.
Right now, I'm still unsure about it.
#2
02-09-2011, 02:30 PM
Ridiculously Active Enthusiast
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Atlanta, Ga
Posts: 1,797
Re: Steve-- Your amazingly high MPG
If you are meaning me, Hot Georgia, there was a lot of things contributing to it. I set a goal to cross a 70MPG tank and I reached that after a few years of "Training" in ideal conditions. Those conditions don't exist for me any longer.
One condition which still exists is a very long daily commute. My work is about 50 miles away from my home. This means my auto spent considerably more time in its nominal engine/drive train running temperature than someone who has a much shorter commute. A shorter commute would require more times starting cold- and a cold engine is a comparatively fuel consuming pig vs one which is warmed up. That applies to all vehicles.
The other condition which is no longer available to me is working off-hours. I used to drive into the city around 6PM while most everyone else was driving out. My roads were mostly clear of traffic.
But most important was my commute home. It was from 2-3am when almost nobody was out driving, especially the side roads.
I'd exit the freeway half way home and take the completely abandoned side roads where I can do a lot of things not otherwise available any other time.
Things like coasting with engine off, coasting in neutral, letting my speed sag to 20 or so MPH to crest a hill etc. My extreme fuel conservation efforts added around 10 minutes to the trip.
But don't let the slow speed make you think it was a boring ride. No, far from it. They were the most exciting drive as I was constantly busy assessing my conditions, wind speed and direction, and many other things to consider.
Extremely laborious, in a good way.
Once I surpassed my goal as indicated in my signature, I backed off being so extreme. Then I was put on a morning shift which really ended it because I was in the thick of traffic with a routine of 10-12 mile Atlanta back ups into the city.
I was very frustrated with it all and completely abandoned my conservative driving, frequenting the hectic fast left lanes, tailgating etc as I raced into work.
I started being moderately conservative about a year ago after they put me on an afternoon shift. (3PM-11:30) I averaged about 60MPG last summer and currently 51MPG this winter only doing basic conservative techniques.
Here are a few tips I use which can be applied to any vehicle.
1. Slow down.
Consumption of fuel increases dramatically starting at around 50-55MPH due to wind resistance. My speed in a 55-65MPH limit is 50 to about 58 depending on conditions. I drive about 60-63 in a 70 zone. I am not saying everyone can drive safely that way. You should be able to judge your conditions and adjust appropriately.
But also I'll add that most people can drive slower than they think in a completely safe manner in the right lane.
Also take wind and wind direction into account.
I get my indications both from my iPhone weather app, and when I'm out on the road I look at how flags on poles are waving as the present indication.
A tail wind is great. I can either speed up a bit more than usual for the same savings or continue at a my normal speed for more conservative driving.
The only way I've found to deal with freeway cross winds is to avoid that situation and use side roads with a lot of trees lining the sides. But side roads can either be good or bad for economy.
Headwinds can be brutal but if you drive at a safe distance behind a large truck the turbulence it causes can reduce head wind effects. I don't draft trucks. I consider it extremely dangerous. Any savings you have will be taxed on the truck's economy. It's stealing in my book.
2. Let your speed sag while climbing hills. This will reduce the effects of your engine overcoming gravity. Also, let your speed increase on the down hill side. This will allow gravity to assist you.
If your vehicle has a belt-driven AC compressor (HCH-1 has) then switch off the compressor while climbing hills or accelerating. Defrost also uses the compressor, but not while the fan is in the OFF position. So you can leave the air direction **** to Defrost with fan OFF to accelrate or climb hills. Just switch the fan ON for other times. Again, safety first. Don't drive around with fogged windows to save a puff of fuel.
I did my personal record MPG by not using AC at all during a brutally hot and humid Georgia summer. I brought a 6-pack size Coleman cooler half filled with ice and water along with a cloth to keep cool. I also brought an extra clean shirt and drove bare foot. That is not something I want to train with again.
3. Keep a steady pace and try not to loose your momentum. Leave plenty of room to the car ahead for a buffer in case they momentarily slow down. Time stop lights for the same reason. Let the car ahead of you trip the light so it's green when you get there.
4. If you travel the same road often you can learn its exact terrain and quirks. Every hill- be it ever so slight and you can learn by the HCH economy guage exactly how much fuel is required for any specific stretch of familiar road. You can get very accurate with practice to save every miniscule spec of fuel vapor by knowing the road.
If you don't have a fairly accurate fuel consumption guage then buy one such as the Scan Guage. Otherwise you won't know the difference between burning 30 or 40MPG. (You might be accelerating or cruising while burning 30MPG when 40 could do the same job) The seat of your pants is not accurate enough.
5. Your fuel consumption guage should read an average rate of consumption along with a real-time instant figure which reacts with your gas pedal. Keep the real-time figure higher than the average as much as possible. This is important to remember the closer you get to your maximum "possible" figure.
6. Be extremely careful and easy on acceleration during engine warm-up. It's gulping comparatively massive amounts of fuel in this time. Don't turn on the fan to deliver cabin heat. Don't just leave the defroster on while it's not needed. The temperature guage indicates coolant temperature, not engine or drive train. Keep the heater fan off for miles past when the temp guage reads normal.
7. Inflate those soft spongey tires!
At 185,00 miles I'm half way through my third set of Donlop tires. I keep them inflated to 50lbs. They're really hard as rock and hard on your bottom but my difference has shown to be around 5-7MPG. Imagine trying to ride your bicycle on a white beach of soft, shifting sand and how much more energy you require to keep moving. Same thing on tires set to 32PSI.
8. HCH users maximize the brake regeneration as you would use a lower transmission gear to downshift. That way your hydraulic brakes can be used very little and you get more benefit from the battery. Again, I am at 185,000 miles and the dealer says my original brake pads have "Plenty" left.
9. Another important aspect of great MPG is emotionally learning how to deal with ash holes. You should always be mindful and considerate to people driving behind you. Don't be a rod hog. Learning to safely and effectively (And politely as possible) how to deal with other drivers and situations while maximizing your savings is part of training.
Changing old, wasteful habits is related to this but can be most difficult.
10. Keep in mind that exceptional fuel economy is not one thing you do, but a combination of every choice you make along each and every trip.
I equate it to building a house of cards. Each mile done correctly and efficiently adds another card to the house. An entire floor is constructed at the end of the trip. By the end of the tank you've constructed many floors in your house of cards. Once you realize the good work you've done at fill-up, your house of cards become a solid galvanized representation of savings.
However your house of cards is extremely fraille during construction and any disturbance will destroy part or all of it. For another words, you can be the most conservative driver for half your tank, then find yourself leaving late for work and drive hard that morning. That will destroy an entire floor or floors in your house and the savings it represents.
Battery-
I've learned that when my Assist comes on while cruising then I'm also using a lot of fuel so I try to avoid using it at all. When the Assist gauge comes on I take it as a high fuel consumption warning (of sort). My result is likely a battery which has not been used as much as usual. At 185,000 miles I have had no indication of battery problem what so ever. My CVT belt assy should be replaced (Which cost as much as a battery) but no battery troubles yet.
I have no advice about any used HCH's, other than asking if it's had regular scheduled maintenance. If it has then I'd need to see the service history printouts from the service center over the life of the vehicle.
If there's a series of CVT fluid flushes over the last 50,000 (or so) miles it may indicate belt slippage issues and I'd take that into consideration.
I really don't consider my results that fantastic. I'm just one of many. There's another person who used to be a member here who went by the name of Exel. He had several vehicles with truly amazing results, especially his 2001 Insight which he worked to over 200MPG.
That's about it for now.
One condition which still exists is a very long daily commute. My work is about 50 miles away from my home. This means my auto spent considerably more time in its nominal engine/drive train running temperature than someone who has a much shorter commute. A shorter commute would require more times starting cold- and a cold engine is a comparatively fuel consuming pig vs one which is warmed up. That applies to all vehicles.
The other condition which is no longer available to me is working off-hours. I used to drive into the city around 6PM while most everyone else was driving out. My roads were mostly clear of traffic.
But most important was my commute home. It was from 2-3am when almost nobody was out driving, especially the side roads.
I'd exit the freeway half way home and take the completely abandoned side roads where I can do a lot of things not otherwise available any other time.
Things like coasting with engine off, coasting in neutral, letting my speed sag to 20 or so MPH to crest a hill etc. My extreme fuel conservation efforts added around 10 minutes to the trip.
But don't let the slow speed make you think it was a boring ride. No, far from it. They were the most exciting drive as I was constantly busy assessing my conditions, wind speed and direction, and many other things to consider.
Extremely laborious, in a good way.
Once I surpassed my goal as indicated in my signature, I backed off being so extreme. Then I was put on a morning shift which really ended it because I was in the thick of traffic with a routine of 10-12 mile Atlanta back ups into the city.
I was very frustrated with it all and completely abandoned my conservative driving, frequenting the hectic fast left lanes, tailgating etc as I raced into work.
I started being moderately conservative about a year ago after they put me on an afternoon shift. (3PM-11:30) I averaged about 60MPG last summer and currently 51MPG this winter only doing basic conservative techniques.
Here are a few tips I use which can be applied to any vehicle.
1. Slow down.
Consumption of fuel increases dramatically starting at around 50-55MPH due to wind resistance. My speed in a 55-65MPH limit is 50 to about 58 depending on conditions. I drive about 60-63 in a 70 zone. I am not saying everyone can drive safely that way. You should be able to judge your conditions and adjust appropriately.
But also I'll add that most people can drive slower than they think in a completely safe manner in the right lane.
Also take wind and wind direction into account.
I get my indications both from my iPhone weather app, and when I'm out on the road I look at how flags on poles are waving as the present indication.
A tail wind is great. I can either speed up a bit more than usual for the same savings or continue at a my normal speed for more conservative driving.
The only way I've found to deal with freeway cross winds is to avoid that situation and use side roads with a lot of trees lining the sides. But side roads can either be good or bad for economy.
Headwinds can be brutal but if you drive at a safe distance behind a large truck the turbulence it causes can reduce head wind effects. I don't draft trucks. I consider it extremely dangerous. Any savings you have will be taxed on the truck's economy. It's stealing in my book.
2. Let your speed sag while climbing hills. This will reduce the effects of your engine overcoming gravity. Also, let your speed increase on the down hill side. This will allow gravity to assist you.
If your vehicle has a belt-driven AC compressor (HCH-1 has) then switch off the compressor while climbing hills or accelerating. Defrost also uses the compressor, but not while the fan is in the OFF position. So you can leave the air direction **** to Defrost with fan OFF to accelrate or climb hills. Just switch the fan ON for other times. Again, safety first. Don't drive around with fogged windows to save a puff of fuel.
I did my personal record MPG by not using AC at all during a brutally hot and humid Georgia summer. I brought a 6-pack size Coleman cooler half filled with ice and water along with a cloth to keep cool. I also brought an extra clean shirt and drove bare foot. That is not something I want to train with again.
3. Keep a steady pace and try not to loose your momentum. Leave plenty of room to the car ahead for a buffer in case they momentarily slow down. Time stop lights for the same reason. Let the car ahead of you trip the light so it's green when you get there.
4. If you travel the same road often you can learn its exact terrain and quirks. Every hill- be it ever so slight and you can learn by the HCH economy guage exactly how much fuel is required for any specific stretch of familiar road. You can get very accurate with practice to save every miniscule spec of fuel vapor by knowing the road.
If you don't have a fairly accurate fuel consumption guage then buy one such as the Scan Guage. Otherwise you won't know the difference between burning 30 or 40MPG. (You might be accelerating or cruising while burning 30MPG when 40 could do the same job) The seat of your pants is not accurate enough.
5. Your fuel consumption guage should read an average rate of consumption along with a real-time instant figure which reacts with your gas pedal. Keep the real-time figure higher than the average as much as possible. This is important to remember the closer you get to your maximum "possible" figure.
6. Be extremely careful and easy on acceleration during engine warm-up. It's gulping comparatively massive amounts of fuel in this time. Don't turn on the fan to deliver cabin heat. Don't just leave the defroster on while it's not needed. The temperature guage indicates coolant temperature, not engine or drive train. Keep the heater fan off for miles past when the temp guage reads normal.
7. Inflate those soft spongey tires!
At 185,00 miles I'm half way through my third set of Donlop tires. I keep them inflated to 50lbs. They're really hard as rock and hard on your bottom but my difference has shown to be around 5-7MPG. Imagine trying to ride your bicycle on a white beach of soft, shifting sand and how much more energy you require to keep moving. Same thing on tires set to 32PSI.
8. HCH users maximize the brake regeneration as you would use a lower transmission gear to downshift. That way your hydraulic brakes can be used very little and you get more benefit from the battery. Again, I am at 185,000 miles and the dealer says my original brake pads have "Plenty" left.
9. Another important aspect of great MPG is emotionally learning how to deal with ash holes. You should always be mindful and considerate to people driving behind you. Don't be a rod hog. Learning to safely and effectively (And politely as possible) how to deal with other drivers and situations while maximizing your savings is part of training.
Changing old, wasteful habits is related to this but can be most difficult.
10. Keep in mind that exceptional fuel economy is not one thing you do, but a combination of every choice you make along each and every trip.
I equate it to building a house of cards. Each mile done correctly and efficiently adds another card to the house. An entire floor is constructed at the end of the trip. By the end of the tank you've constructed many floors in your house of cards. Once you realize the good work you've done at fill-up, your house of cards become a solid galvanized representation of savings.
However your house of cards is extremely fraille during construction and any disturbance will destroy part or all of it. For another words, you can be the most conservative driver for half your tank, then find yourself leaving late for work and drive hard that morning. That will destroy an entire floor or floors in your house and the savings it represents.
Battery-
I've learned that when my Assist comes on while cruising then I'm also using a lot of fuel so I try to avoid using it at all. When the Assist gauge comes on I take it as a high fuel consumption warning (of sort). My result is likely a battery which has not been used as much as usual. At 185,000 miles I have had no indication of battery problem what so ever. My CVT belt assy should be replaced (Which cost as much as a battery) but no battery troubles yet.
I have no advice about any used HCH's, other than asking if it's had regular scheduled maintenance. If it has then I'd need to see the service history printouts from the service center over the life of the vehicle.
If there's a series of CVT fluid flushes over the last 50,000 (or so) miles it may indicate belt slippage issues and I'd take that into consideration.
I really don't consider my results that fantastic. I'm just one of many. There's another person who used to be a member here who went by the name of Exel. He had several vehicles with truly amazing results, especially his 2001 Insight which he worked to over 200MPG.
That's about it for now.
Last edited by Hot_Georgia_2004; 02-09-2011 at 03:14 PM.
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