I have a fairly new 2005 HCH with a manual transission. I'm finding that the shift effort is quite high when I downshift into first gear at anything above a crawl and especially if I'm above 10 MPH. At times, the transmission has balked and I've had to shift back into neutral, slow down and try again. I don't believe that any of my attempted downshifts into first gear would have resulted in an engine speed above 3,000 RPM.

This condition exists when the car has sat overnight and after it has been driven for about 30 minutes so I don't think it's related to the temperature of the transmission fluid.

Any comments are greatly appreciated.

 

When you shift into first gear at anything over a crawl the transmission has to speed up using a friction gear-clutch mechanism called a synchro. In order for this to happen it's best to shift a bit slower into first so that it has time to spin up and synchronize before meshing. There might be something wrong with the 1st gear synchro, but probably not.

 

Something else to consider is that while hypermiling, or at least while attempting to get as much MPG out of my own MT HCH as possible, I find it VERY RARE to need to shift into first gear at anything other than a virtual stop...anything other that than, I just use second gear.

I must honestly say this has never been a problem for me, at all.....

Ladera HCH, can you elaborate for us a situation where you think shifting to first gear at higher speeds is necessary and/or appropriate? I can't imagine what you are doing, so please end my confusion.....Thanks !!

 

double clutch and you won't have this problem. but you really should ever be switching into 1st gear while moving. 2nd should be fine.

 

Just to clarify, I rarely use first gear other than from 0 MPH and usually try to use the highest gear possible to minimize pumping losses. I find that with the IMA, there's usually enough torque to pull away in 2nd gear when I'm at a crawl.

The one place where I would like to use first gear is to merge on a particular on ramp during rush hour. The acceleration lane is usually at a slow crawl and turns into an exit lane. The next lane on the left is usually moving at about 20 mph differential. The extra acceleration by using first would provide a helpful safety cushion when merging.

My feeling is that the synchro for first is a bit weaker than the other gears since shifting into first while moving is not that common. That said, I've been able to shift into first at a reasonable speed in other cars without any issue. I'll try double-clutching to see if it helps.

Thank you for the comments.

 

From way back when I first started to learn to use a MT, I was told, never, EVER, shift into first gear while moving. It is to get the car rolling from a dead stop, period. Some MTs have a first gear that is a creeper gear, that you rarely ever use (I remember an old F150 truck I had, always started in 2nd).

If my HCH MT is moving, I opt for second gear. The engine, IMA, and gear ratios are such that it will get the car up to 10-15 MPH and that's enough for third. Note, if you have hills and traffic is extremely tight, you may push the speed higher before shifting.

 

Is this your first small manual transmission car? I've never EVER driven a 4-cylinder manual transmission car that liked to go into first while rolling unless you double-clutch and rev match the shift. Generally most folks have no idea what that means unfortunately. I've driven V6 and V8 cars, which likely have much bigger and more expensive transmissions, and they will often go into 1st gear without much trouble while rolling, but for every 4-cyl car I've driven, regardless of brand, they do not design the syncros on 1st for a rolling downshift.

 

This isn't my first manual transmission car. The specific models I know of that will shift into first above a creep are an Infiniti I30 (V6) and a BMW 325 (I6). A 1983 Volvo 240 (I4) will also downshift into first, but that car's drivetrain was seemed to be pretty sturdy.

In the interest of fuel economy (and the longevity of my transmission) I'll do my best to avoid first gear.

 

I think the reason the shift you describe is harder is that the synchro-mesh has to work harder to spin-up the 1st gear when you are moving. I have driven MT's for years and they all were this way to varying degrees, so much so that I almost never downshift into 1st over about 5 mph, but sometimes you just need to do it, and I don't think it hurts the car unless you hear the gears grind.

The HCH is actually one of the easiest shifting trannies I have ever driven. I can snap-shift from 1-2, 2-3, and 3-4 faster than almost any other car I have owned.

I once accidentally tried to shift into 1st (I meant to go to 3rd) at about 35 mph on my '82 Subaru wagon. It just plain refused to do it, I thought my tranny had busted for a second, but quickly realized the synchro-mesh had protected me nicely.

Therefore you can use the difficulty of shifting into 1st as the car giving you legitimate feedback on what it likes to do, so if I was you I would drop speed slightly to where the downshift is comfortable, shift into 1st and mash it for the high accelleration it sounds like you want. I have done this myself many times in other cars, slow down just so I could get into first and then gun it. :-)

It is also true that over 20 years ago 1st gear had no synchro-mesh on many cars (which is almost unheard of today BTW, they all have synchro in 1st), same wth reverse, you had to shift in from a dead stop only, or double clutch, but even that didn't help much, the gears would still grind if you were moving (I am not sure but I believe that some cars still do not have synchro in reverse today).

The gear ratios are really tall in the HCH MT, which is why its 0-60 times are so much worse than the CVT, so I can understand why you would want to do a 1st gear accelleration to merge with traffic in certain cases.

FYI, mph at redline (calculated, I have only verified the first two) with stock wheels/tires are:

1st: 33 (good luck downshifting into 1st over 10 mph though)
2nd: 61
3rd: 98
4th: 133 (theoretical, limited at 114 mph)
5th: 160 (theoretical, limited at 114 mph)

Anyone ever get their HCH up to 114? I have never even been close. :-)

One of the lessons I got from the above chart is that passing on two lane roads at freeway speeds is best done in 3rd gear for maximum power. I have yet to do this and don't want to as this car ain't that fast to begin with, but at least a 3rd gear move from about 60-85 mph is possible without having to upshift while you are passing. If the pass started at 45 I would downshift to second and figure I would gain more than the loss of having to upshift to 3rd mid-pass.

 

Yes, I have. I actually went to 117. Down a huge hill in PA off of 78 near Allentown.