I posted this over in the HAH forum, but fits here too-

Has anyone thrown some E85 (straight or mixed tank) into their hybrid? Particularly Honda folks. I'm curious to know if the very lean fuel burn screws up VTEC, since the engine is already confused by the high ethanol % and cannot adjust timing any further.

I've determined that the hardware can handle E85- there is no natural rubber or Aluminum in the fuel system.

I figure that since engines all handle 10% ethanol, kicking it up to 25% or so probably won't confuse the computer too much, but I dunno.

There are 2 E85 stations by me...I'll swing by and look at the prices, probably put some in the Explorer at least, for a test.

 

"I figure that since engines all handle 10% ethanol, kicking it up to 25% or so probably won't confuse the computer too much, but I dunno."

Yeah, but 85% might be a bit much, no?

 

I'm not looking to use straight E85. More like 1/4 to 1/2 tank, the rest gas. Like every 2nd or 3rd partial fillup. If its not more expensive (need to check the price there).

Many of the posts I read had people going straight E85, with no problem other than idiot lights and hard starts on cool mornings. I'd go there if I drove a beater.

 

I called Honda customer relations today and asked about E85 compatibility with the HCH'03. they sure weren't keen on the idea! The said it was "highly unrecommended". Of course, I could always give it a try once the car is paid off, ha ha.

 

I replied to your other post here but will echo on this thread. The WikipediA article seems pretty complete on this subject.

 

thanks!

 

The Citgo here in Crabtown has E85 for $2.99, vs $2.85 for 87 octane. Figures. Although with the nearest E85 plant being 700 miles away, it was to be expected.

The Maryland farmers are trying to raise financing to build a still in MD- the 1st on the East Coast, I think? I don't know whether it would be on the Eastern Shore or out by Frederick- either is probably a good choice, though I think most of the corn is grown on the Eastern Shore.

While I was at the station, I saw an Explorer FFV tank up (with a SOCCER MOM driving!) and a state gov't Taurus. Good to know the fuel isn't just stagnating in the underground storage tank!

For anyone headed through Annapolis headed up/down the East coast, the station is right off of US50E. Take the 450/MD2 exit (Parole), and hang a left onto West St. It's one block on the left. They also sell B10 (didn't see the price).

 

If the ford escape came as an FFV, I'd consider switching from my HCH. Ultimately, I wouldn't because I live in TX and there's no hope of finding E85 here. I'd be better off going diesel and getting B100 from the place up in Richardson that's selling it at the pump.

 

it won't take much to get hybrids running on E85, check out the results on a stock 2003 Prius:

http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:...edproject.org/

Drivability during the road tests also highlighted the difference in cold driving performance between the two fuels. When the engine was powered using ethanol it felt sluggish and the idle quality was rougher. After a time of between 9 to 15 minutes, the ethanol performance improved and there was no noticeable difference in drivability between the two fuels.
While using E-85, the check engine light came on. Upon inspection this produced a code indicating a lean condition was detected. During this time, it was noted that the check engine light for the lean code would come on between 140-160 miles since clearing the code. The oxygen sensor output and the short-term fuel trim all indicated that the Air/Fuel ratio to be stoichiometric, and that the fuel control module was maintaining the correct amount of fuel required. What was setting off the check engine light was that the system monitors the change in the base fuel map, which is indicated by the long-term fuel trim, and if this change is outside of the set boundaries for an extended period of time, then a code would be set to indicate that the fuel system is making greater adjustments to the fuel quantity to maintain the correct air/fuel mixture than would be necessary under normal circumstances. The use of ethanol caused the fuel system to adapt the long-term fuel trim by an increase of 32.81%. This supports the lower average fuel economy of ethanol in the results.

Measured performance:

Gasoline
64bhp @4500rpm
80lb-ft @4200rpm

E-85
77bhp @4700rpm
106lb-ft @4250rpm

 

thanks Schwa! Impressive gains in power- expected, but still cool to see.

The summary supports all that I've read about E85 in regular vehicles, and extends it to at least the Prius. It's good to know that the controls can handle the E85 and continue to fully combust it, and the CE light is more of a "out of parameter" indication in this case (other risks related to nonstandard fuels notwithstanding).

Hondas have different engine technology, though- with lean-burn and/or VTEC, I still don't know enough about the details to be able to predict the effects.

FWIW, I'm building my confidence to try it in the HAH. I've been running "E1/3" (initially 7.8gal E85 in a 20gal tank, adjusted on refillls) in the (non-FFV) Explorer for a week now, with no comments from my wife. I haven't refilled yet, but it looks to be about a 10% reduction in FE, as expected (about 3% per 10% ethanol concentration).

The E85 pump near me is at $2.25 now, with the lowest regular I've seen at $2.40, so I'm not breaking even fiscally, but that's not what this is about.

As it gets colder, I think I'll keep it at this concentration- I really don't want to hear it from my wife about her car not starting on the 1st turn or running rough for the 1st few miles.

I just filled the HAH. When I burn off 6-7gal I'll put in E85 for "E1/3" there and see what happens.