Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

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  #11  
Old 01-16-2013, 07:26 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by jswjr600
I think you missed my point, which was that avoiding a problem like this is a public relations roasted in waiting.

But, to address yours, Hyundai is currently paying out to customers who are not getting the mileage claimed.

Apparently, the EPA gives manufacturers the standards for testing for MPG, they may or may not do the actual testing. Manufacturers can probably game that system.

Also, when I enter Ford c-max in Google news, there are a whole bunch of articles stating that the c-max is not meeting mileage claims. That is not what you want to sell cars whose main selling point is its mileage.
You have zero evidence that Ford did anything except follow the EPA test procedure. Unless and until it is determined that Ford did not follow the test guidelines or that the EPA test accurately reflects actual use mileage for advanced hybrids, you are basically blowing smoke.
 
  #12  
Old 01-16-2013, 08:19 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Simple. Ford didn't like paying the HSD license fees to Toyota so they "engineered" a new hybrid design. The new design didn't meet the competitive criteria so they fudged the numbers.
 
  #13  
Old 01-16-2013, 09:28 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by wwest
Simple. Ford didn't like paying the HSD license fees to Toyota so they "engineered" a new hybrid design. The new design didn't meet the competitive criteria so they fudged the numbers.
If you have any, and I mean any proof of this, post it now. Otherwise, like most of your posts, we will have to assume you have no idea what you are talking about.
 
  #14  
Old 01-16-2013, 12:07 PM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by travelover
If you have any, and I mean any proof of this, post it now. Otherwise, like most of your posts, we will have to assume you have no idea what you are talking about.

We are about to find out. The EPA decided there was enough of a basis to to launch an investigation.

http://www.dailytech.com/EPA+Ready+t...ticle29656.htm

In any case, before you started calling everybody a liar that didn't agree with your world view, my original point which drew a comparison to the Toyota issues, was regarding PR. Bottom line is that when most of the press surrounding your new launch of a hybrid vehicle is centered on its failure to achieve mileage claims, you are probably going to be losing potential customers.

Thumbing your nose (Ford and Toyota both squarely blamed the customer, instead of proposing solutions for their respective problems) at your consumer base rarely leads to new or return customers.
 
  #15  
Old 01-17-2013, 06:08 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by jswjr600
We are about to find out. The EPA decided there was enough of a basis to to launch an investigation.

http://www.dailytech.com/EPA+Ready+t...ticle29656.htm

In any case, before you started calling everybody a liar that didn't agree with your world view, my original point which drew a comparison to the Toyota issues, was regarding PR. Bottom line is that when most of the press surrounding your new launch of a hybrid vehicle is centered on its failure to achieve mileage claims, you are probably going to be losing potential customers.

Thumbing your nose (Ford and Toyota both squarely blamed the customer, instead of proposing solutions for their respective problems) at your consumer base rarely leads to new or return customers.
From your link
EPA officials are confident that efficiency claims are true, but will investigate
Kinda blows a hole in your flimsy allegation doesn't it? Excuse Ford for not falling on their sword to mollify the whiners.

You might want to read this as well. http://www.inautonews.com/ford-says-...s#.UPgEwieYs1s

According to Raj Nair, Ford’s product development chief, some of Toyota’s Prius hybrid models had even bigger fuel-economy shortfalls compared with the EPA estimates than Ford C-Max hybrid and Fusion hybrid when tested by the Consumer Reports magazine.
In the past the EPA had to redesign their test to better reflect typical customer mileage. Don't it seem likely that they are behind the curve again on advanced hybrids?
 
  #16  
Old 01-19-2013, 10:01 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by travelover
If you have any, and I mean any proof of this, post it now. Otherwise, like most of your posts, we will have to assume you have no idea what you are talking about.
"You" may make any "assumption" you wish.
 
  #17  
Old 01-19-2013, 10:12 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by travelover
From your link Kinda blows a hole in your flimsy allegation doesn't it? Excuse Ford for not falling on their sword to mollify the whiners.

You might want to read this as well. http://www.inautonews.com/ford-says-...s#.UPgEwieYs1s

In the past the EPA had to redesign their test to better reflect typical customer mileage. Don't it seem likely that they are behind the curve again on advanced hybrids?
"...advanced hybrids...." Ford...?? Retardation more likely.

Couldn't make the Escape 4WD system workable so it was abandoned, now "auto" mode F/awd ONLY.

And Ford can't even make a simple turbocharging system workable...Ford F150 "EcoBoost". How many "fixes" will they throw at that "wall" before something "sticks".
 
  #18  
Old 01-19-2013, 02:07 PM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by wwest
"...advanced hybrids...." Ford...?? Retardation more likely.

Couldn't make the Escape 4WD system workable so it was abandoned, now "auto" mode F/awd ONLY.

And Ford can't even make a simple turbocharging system workable...Ford F150 "EcoBoost". How many "fixes" will they throw at that "wall" before something "sticks".

As usual, Mr. West is unable to produce any statistical evidence for any of his wild claims. Don't ask him what type of evidence this is as he doesn't know. No wonder Lexus never hired him to teach their workers---his statement in the past.
 
  #19  
Old 01-19-2013, 03:17 PM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by Billyk24
As usual, Mr. West is unable to produce any statistical evidence for any of his wild claims. Don't ask him what type of evidence this is as he doesn't know. No wonder Lexus never hired him to teach their workers---his statement in the past.
West has zero credibility here - he is basically just a troll.
 
  #20  
Old 01-23-2013, 09:29 AM
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Default Re: Ford Sued over Fusion, C-Max Mileage Claims

Originally Posted by travelover
West has zero credibility here - he is basically just a troll.
Here or anywhere else.

As to the investigation. I believe that Hyundai did not follow procedures correctly, and therefore had to provide restitution. If Ford followed procedures and simply published the results, then there is nothing wrong with what they did - the procedures and testing need to be updated for Hybrids (which is true anyway).
 


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