TPMS-is it necessary?

  #21  
Old 12-19-2013, 08:57 PM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

On my FEH, there is a 100% correlation between whether there's a TPMS error and whether the cruise control works. It makes sense to disable cruise control if there's a low tire, but it's still annoying since probably most TPMS errors are the fault of the systems, not tire pressure.
 
  #22  
Old 12-20-2013, 07:04 AM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by xspirit View Post
On my FEH, there is a 100% correlation between whether there's a TPMS error and whether the cruise control works. It makes sense to disable cruise control if there's a low tire, but it's still annoying since probably most TPMS errors are the fault of the systems, not tire pressure.
Why does it make sense? I had a TPMS fault and still had cruise control.
 
  #23  
Old 12-20-2013, 08:28 AM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by wptski View Post
Why does it make sense? I had a TPMS fault and still had cruise control.
It does make sense to disable CC if the system thinks you have low tire pressure. In my case, the sensors were gone and I had CC without a doubt. I don't know what was causing your fault or xspirit, but he loss CC. Also, programming could have changed during the '09 year. I know my '09 was an early build date and I think yours was also.

Gary
 
  #24  
Old 12-20-2013, 10:44 AM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by GaryG View Post
It does make sense to disable CC if the system thinks you have low tire pressure. In my case, the sensors were gone and I had CC without a doubt. I don't know what was causing your fault or xspirit, but he loss CC. Also, programming could have changed during the '09 year. I know my '09 was an early build date and I think yours was also.

Gary
Yes, mine was an early build but the PCM has been flashed three times with the last time being in 2010 so it's programming isn't OEM.

Of all the things that a low tire might affect like ABS which may not be visible like CC is. Neither of you have tried to explain your reasoning other than stating, it makes sense, how?

When I got my my fault, I was between small towns and stopped at a one pump station with a $0.25 compressor. No pressure(I carry mine now) so I just hit each tire a bit. I made a restroom stop at the next town, TPMS was ON at the restart but OFF just out of the parking lot. Stayed OFF for 20 miles or so and came back ON.

After getting home, one or two were at 25psi. It stay OFF for weeks then cam back ON with correct air pressure. It was ON when I drove into my dealer and they replaced two sensors that wouldn't train.

Some vehicles TPMS system will actually show tire pressure. Not sure if any Ford product has that?
 
  #25  
Old 12-20-2013, 11:39 AM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Bill, PCM programming changes are very rare, and have to include only specific changes to the programming as built programming originally designed for your car. Most reflashes come from the stored inactive side of your PCM. In other words, Ford changes equipment on the assembly line all the time and the PCM programming is constantly changing. You can't replace the '09 as built programming with a 2010 PCM as built programming because of all the equipment changes from the date your PCM was programmed. Ford does and can provide updated and original as built programming if your PCM is destroyed and the original programming cannot be retrieved for the original PCM inactive side.

It very well may be a PCM programming change to turn off CC in an '09 built after ours, but that doesn't mean the new programming will be updated to our as built programming. Equipment or wiring may have been changed together with new programming, and it may not even be possible.

Gary
 
  #26  
Old 12-20-2013, 12:27 PM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by wptski View Post
Why does it make sense? I had a TPMS fault and still had cruise control.
It makes sense to disable cruise control when there is a low tire pressure situation detected because if you have the choice between a vehicle proceeding with low tire pressure (such as a flat) AND locked into a given throttle setting; or proceeding with low tire pressure and NOT locked into a given throttle setting, then the latter is preferable. In the sense of a choice between the two, a manufacturer would be seen to have covered their bases more responsibly if, say, a tire pressure matter resulted in an accident, injury, lawsuit etc.; and the manufacturer had chosen the safer setup.

Similarly, if you are driving and you feel you may become drowsy or you may encounter slippery pavement, does it make more sense to use, or not use, cruise control?
 
  #27  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by GaryG View Post
Bill, PCM programming changes are very rare, and have to include only specific changes to the programming as built programming originally designed for your car. Most reflashes come from the stored inactive side of your PCM. In other words, Ford changes equipment on the assembly line all the time and the PCM programming is constantly changing. You can't replace the '09 as built programming with a 2010 PCM as built programming because of all the equipment changes from the date your PCM was programmed. Ford does and can provide updated and original as built programming if your PCM is destroyed and the original programming cannot be retrieved for the original PCM inactive side.

It very well may be a PCM programming change to turn off CC in an '09 built after ours, but that doesn't mean the new programming will be updated to our as built programming. Equipment or wiring may have been changed together with new programming, and it may not even be possible.

Gary
I was told that when you get the latest IDS version for your VIN, it's everything that's changed for your VIN since the IDS version in your PCM. Are you saying that the '09FEH would be different than a '09 FE when it comes to this?

If they had a safety concern about, they would have included it in my last PCM flash.
 

Last edited by wptski; 12-20-2013 at 04:24 PM.
  #28  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:22 PM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by xspirit View Post
It makes sense to disable cruise control when there is a low tire pressure situation detected because if you have the choice between a vehicle proceeding with low tire pressure (such as a flat) AND locked into a given throttle setting; or proceeding with low tire pressure and NOT locked into a given throttle setting, then the latter is preferable. In the sense of a choice between the two, a manufacturer would be seen to have covered their bases more responsibly if, say, a tire pressure matter resulted in an accident, injury, lawsuit etc.; and the manufacturer had chosen the safer setup.

Similarly, if you are driving and you feel you may become drowsy or you may encounter slippery pavement, does it make more sense to use, or not use, cruise control?
If they were indeed worried about that, they would have had it programmed to defeat cruise control when a wheel speed sensor detects slippage. I don't think your analogy holds up.

In a search I found an owner of another manufacturer's vehicle that stated that a TPMS fault defeats the traction control ON/OFF switch.
 
  #29  
Old 12-20-2013, 07:07 PM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by wptski View Post
I was told that when you get the latest IDS version for your VIN, it's everything that's changed for your VIN since the IDS version in your PCM. Are you saying that the '09FEH would be different than a '09 FE when it comes to this?

If they had a safety concern about, they would have included it in my last PCM flash.
It's true, Ford does updates software specifically for your VIN or as built programming, but it is to solve problems, not update programming because of new changes. In most cases, you have to point out a problem or a TSB is sent to you to bring in your vehicle for repair. The tech may see other updates on the IDS system for your VIN, but most Techs don't get paid for updates that are not on the work order, so they don't waste their time working for free updating them. It doesn't matter if you have a FEH or FE.

You were claiming you have updated to the '10 PCM because that was the last time it was flashed. Updating TSB's is not a complete reflash of the PCM and update of all changes in new models after your FE was built.

Gary
 
  #30  
Old 12-21-2013, 06:56 AM
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Default Re: TPMS-is it necessary?

Originally Posted by GaryG View Post
It's true, Ford does updates software specifically for your VIN or as built programming, but it is to solve problems, not update programming because of new changes. In most cases, you have to point out a problem or a TSB is sent to you to bring in your vehicle for repair. The tech may see other updates on the IDS system for your VIN, but most Techs don't get paid for updates that are not on the work order, so they don't waste their time working for free updating them. It doesn't matter if you have a FEH or FE.

You were claiming you have updated to the '10 PCM because that was the last time it was flashed. Updating TSB's is not a complete reflash of the PCM and update of all changes in new models after your FE was built.

Gary
That's incorrect. There are TSB's where the only work performed was a PCM flash and it lists the time it took. Time isn't free, they do get paid for that.

There has been far more problems with the FE than FEH especially since 2009 when the new 6F35 transaxle was "first" installed in the Escape. There were many programming changes made because of it.

I didn't say that I had an update to '10 PCM. I said that my PCM was flashed in 2010. The IDS version is by number not by specific module, component, etc. I seen TBS's which have stated to use a certain IDS number or higher. Does that sound specific to a certain module or component?

BTW: A Ford Tech in another forum stated that they have never seen a TPMS fault cause any other problem on any Ford product.
 

Last edited by wptski; 12-21-2013 at 07:01 AM.
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