http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/07/...rid.php?page=1
What a clever marketing approach, insulting Prius buyers while ignoring the Prius performance. As long as anyone in Detroit continues to believe this nonsense, they will continue to decline.

There are many engineering reasons for building a dedicated hybrid that includes:

• advanced materials
• electrically driven AC and power accessories
• improved aerodynamics
• improved suspension
• electric driven water pump
• exhaust turbo generator

These are real engineering issues and hiding a hybrid in the shape of out-dated, inefficient, gas-only vehicles doesn't make a lick of sense. Yet curiously, engineering, designing for function remains beyond the understanding of these intellectual fossils. So they revert to insults, as if that will bring back customers.

It is more likely they are using insults to try and keep their remaining customers in-line. But as we used to say in the Marines, money talks and bovine fecal matter walks.

Bob Wilson

 

Sorry Bob; I could not help but to conjure up images of the Camry and the Lexus hybrids.

Perhaps that is not what you meant.

Cheers;

MSantos

 

I'm sorry - I don't see where you think there is an insult to Prius buyers in that article. Am I being overly naive?

 

Hi,

The implication is we didn't choose the car because it was the best value for the buck (it is for those driving my miles) or the future of personal transportation in an energy starved world. The implication is we chose our hybrids like folks might chose jewelry or a pair of shoes.

This "style" statement is behind CNW Marketing claiming our Prius get few miles per year than other cars. Yet Doug has already surveyed Ebay used auto sales and demonstrated that is not the case. But this lame claim suggests to the consumers of CNW's BS that 'once the fad passes, everyone will go back to buying ordinary cars.' The implication is they just need to find the right "style" or design in a gas-only car and hybrid will disappear. Another contribution to "famous last words."

To me, it is an insult but I think the real target are those who continue to buy gas-only cars. They are trying to find someway to justify staying with existing gas-only cars. Those who quote CNW Marketing are grasping at straws, anything to avoid saying what is abundantly clear:

HYBRIDS WORK!

The only statement I make with my Prius is the vanity license plate:

BTW, to a greater or lessor extent, I like the other hybrids but realize when you design a hybrid from the ground up, a lot of legacy aspects of existing gas-only cars need to go away! For example, cabin heating and cooling needs to be redesigned from the ground up.

With a gas-only vehicle, they are so inefficient that tapping the engine coolant for heat is no performance penalty. But that is not the case with our hybrids. We need to preserve every bit of waste heat and in particular, start mining the exhaust pipe. It also makes sense to use an electric compressor for the AC instead of turning the engine over. That engine should ONLY turn over to recharge the batteries or meet power demands beyond the current battery/motor demand. This is what I mean by a purpose built hybrid. I don't care what the shell looks like as long as it is efficient and safe.

I applaud Toyota building purpose built hybrids. It shows a commitment to performance that like the air-intake vent of T-bird or other functional performance structures and machines, means the engineers are getting permission to expand the envelope.

Bob Wilson

 

Bob, isn't it great to be living in a world where the diversity of our ideals are as diverse as our own experiences?

While I don't necessarily agree with some of your reasonings and assertions, I do acknowledge the due merit and validity of your perspective. My hope is that at some point, our ideals and best wishes for the planet we live in will converge... until then GreenHybrid and other forums will likely remain a good starting point.

Take care;

MSantos

 

Bob,

Thanks for the elaboration. I believe I understand where you are coming from. I think MSantos expresses well what I want to say, though. Although I don't entirely agree with your viewpoint, I most certainly do respect it. I personally find nothing wrong with buying a car to make a statement. There is a lot of that in my decision to go with a Camry Hybrid, and it probably would be one of the first things off my lips, right or wrong. Feeling that way though doesn't lessen the fact that I also think it is a well performing car in its class.

I'm not familiar with CNW, but I re-read the article you referenced, and I'm afraid I can't see any of the negative implications you talk about, at least from that article alone. Perhaps if I read it in context of other things they've said, I would interpret it differently.

The statement I think I am making, by the way, is that I've chosen a car with a smaller environmental impact than most, and I hope that others will follow my example.

 

I agree with my fellow TCHer, Randy! I was not planning to buy my hybrid this year, but unfortunately, I was sideswiped at 60mph on a curvy road here in Pacifica in April, and my 91 Previa took the brunt of it. Even tho the Previa looked okay on the other sides, and the engine had just been rebuilt, my insurance company refused to cover the total costs of repairing my vehicle. They said I could drive a salvaged vehicle and that they would give me what they thought it was worth which would have not paid more than 50% of the repair costs.

So, my DH is patiently waiting another year to replace his 88 Integra, I did lots of research and I mean LOTS before we chose the TCH. I am glad that I did because I would have gotten either a Prius or a Civic LX until I started reading owner blogs about certain issues that those owners were having that I would have too if I bought those vehicles. My hours of researching and test driving made it a very easy decision to buy the TCH. And my husband who wasn't planning on spending that much for a car originally, was okay with spending that much, because we had done that research. If I spent that much time on clothes shopping I would never get out of the mall! OTOH, there are people who buy cars like that and I wish them well.

And for the record, YES, I am making a statement with my car purchase. I am interested in the following:
cutting down on toxic emissions
good mileage
safety and comfort for alas an aging bod!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are not THAT Geeky or Techy!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are fun!

I could go on a lot more but I have already!

 

I agree with my fellow TCHer, Randy! I was not planning to buy my hybrid this year, but unfortunately, I was sideswiped at 60mph on a curvy road here in Pacifica in April, and my 91 Previa took the brunt of it. Even tho the Previa looked okay on the other sides, and the engine had just been rebuilt, my insurance company refused to cover the total costs of repairing my vehicle. They said I could drive a salvaged vehicle and that they would give me what they thought it was worth which would have not paid more than 50% of the repair costs.

So, my DH is patiently waiting another year to replace his 88 Integra. I did lots of research and I mean LOTS before we chose the TCH. I am glad that I did because I would have gotten either a Prius or a Civic LX until I started reading owner blogs about certain issues that those owners were having that I would have too if I bought those vehicles. My hours of researching and test driving made it a very easy decision to buy the TCH. And my husband who wasn't planning on spending that much for a car originally, was okay with spending that much, because we had done that research. If I spent that much time on clothes shopping I would never get out of the mall! OTOH, there are people who buy cars like that and I wish them well.

And for the record, YES, I am making a statement with my car purchase. I am interested in the following:
cutting down on toxic emissions
good mileage
safety and comfort for alas an aging bod!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are NOT Geeky or Techy!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are fun!

I could go on a lot more but I have already!

 

Sorry about the duplicate posts! Didn't realize it had gone thru after all!
Still learning how to do these weblogs!

 

I agree with my fellow TCHer, Randy! I was not planning to buy my hybrid this year, but unfortunately, I was sideswiped at 60mph on a curvy road here in Pacifica in April, and my 91 Previa took the brunt of it. Even tho the Previa looked okay on the other sides, and the engine had just been rebuilt, my insurance company refused to cover the total costs of repairing my vehicle. They said I could drive a salvaged vehicle and that they would give me what they thought it was worth which would have not paid more than 50% of the repair costs.

So, my DH is patiently waiting another year to replace his 88 Integra, I did lots of research and I mean LOTS before we chose the TCH. I am glad that I did because I would have gotten either a Prius or a Civic LX until I started reading owner blogs about certain issues that those owners were having that I would have too if I bought those vehicles. My hours of researching and test driving made it a very easy decision to buy the TCH. And my husband who wasn't planning on spending that much for a car originally, was okay with spending that much, because we had done that research. If I spent that much time on clothes shopping I would never get out of the mall! OTOH, there are people who buy cars like that and I wish them well.

And for the record, YES, I am making a statement with my car purchase. I am interested in the following:
cutting down on toxic emissions
good mileage
safety and comfort for alas an aging bod!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are not THAT Geeky or Techy!
encouraging others that hybrid cars are fun!

I could go on a lot more but I have already!