Car: 2005 HCH I, CVT, almost 40K miles. I have had no problems at all from it and drive it often (work from home). Average MPG was in the low-mid 50s, then I got some new tires and since it's averaged low-mid 40s. Bought it in '06 from a local (TN) Honda dealer as certified pre-owned and unsure of state it was originally sold in. It has a new 12v battery made in 12/2014.

To the best of my knowledge, the ECM has NOT been re-flashed or upgraded by Honda. No other software updates have been done.

About a week ago the IMA and Check Engine Lights came on (P1600 and P1433) at the same time and stayed on. When I got home, I thought it a fluke and disconnected the 12v battery for a few minutes. The lights went away; then later came back at the same time. Then the IMA light went off while the CEL stayed on.

There has been no degradation of the IMA so far; the Charge/Assist works correctly and there has been no sudden drops or jumps in the IMA battery level per the gauge. While the lights are on it still functions properly that I can see. If it weren't for these 2 lights, I'd never know something is wrong.

I took it to Honda to see if I still qualified for a warranty replacement. An inept tech told me I did, then didn't. And a replacement IMA pack would "only" cost me $2,500. I mentioned warranty extension SB 12-077, but he didn't seem to know exactly what was going on.

So I'm screwed. After some quick research on this and other forums, I have come up with several options, in no order of preference.

1. Buy it from Honda. The tech told me the pack would have new, unused cells in it, which I corrected him that they don't; they're refurbished packs from other Civics. He then told me that "the other guy's" packs are untested with no warranties.

2. Buy one from online, like Bumblebee. It costs a bit less, but still it's a large chunk of change. Plus it has a warranty.

3. Not buy one off ebay or a junkyard, as I don't know how long they've sat there and they have little or no warranty.

4. Visit other local Honda dealers to inquire about my IMA warranty and see if they'll help. I've read posts about owners convincing a dealer to allow the warranty; how did they do it exactly?

5. Call Honda America and explain my case and hope they allow it. Does this ever work?

6. Get a grid charger and attempt to repair it that way.

From what I've read, batteries like mine can be recovered in this manner. But I'm not exactly sure what type of GC I need or the features it should have. What is the best one, with the best features, for the best price?
If I knew someone local I'd ask to borrow theirs. And if it works, buy my own.

This apparently has the bonus of not having to remove the IMA battery pack from the car. Even if this takes a few days, I do have a beater I can drive in the meantime.

I've seen sites where the entire pack was removed from the car, the cells removed and unwrapped, and each one charged/discharged a number of times before being rebalanced and reinserted into the pack. Using this method with the IMA pack removed, can the car be driven?

I know it'll start from the 12v battery, but it'd be nice not to let the car sit there for a month while this is being done.

Anyone who has had issues like mine, what did you do? And how has it worked out?

 

You've described a very typical and common condition. Kudos to you for your thorough research.

Items 1-6 are all very viable. I do not recommend #1.

#6 is your most realistic, cheap option for P1600/1433.

The most popular GC is from Hybridautomotive.com. MaxxVolts makes a nice one too for a little more.

You can build your own for less than $50, but you sacrifice a LOT of convenience.

The car will NOT run w/o the pack installed, but you can install a pack without sticks and configure it so that it will run. It will only charge the 12V between about 1500 and 3500 rpm. It can operate this way indefinitely, and your mileage will improve if you are getting frequent recalibrations. You indicate you aren't, but I'm surprised to read that you're not.

Given the low miles, I recommend you try to get a warranty replacement. If not, I recommend you go the grid charger route. The GC will probably buy you another 1-2 years of favorable operation with grid charging every 1-3 months.

Adding your location to your profile might help you in locating a local GC.

 

Thanks for your fast reply.
I forgot to fill out that section in my profile. It's Knoxville, TN.
I've been reading up on both of the GCs mentioned. What is the consensus on the best one? Does anyone here have any good or bad things to say about either one?

 

Both are good. I prefer the HA because the vendor is a regular contributor on Insight Central and a key service provider for the Insight community.

 

I've been on the phone with American Honda the past few weeks.
The CS rep was very polite and asked for some info: VIN, dealer I bought from/took the car to, mileage, error codes, estimate from dealer.

Having that info, he said he'd call back in 3 days, and he did. The dealer told him the new pack would be $2800+, when the paper they gave me quoted $2500.

Past vehicle service there was taken into account, the low mileage, and the other 3 Hondas my family bought there. Rep told me that the extended IMA warranty expired in Sept. 2014, and since I got the errors in Feb 2015, they could help me out. I hoped for the best.

Then he called back and delivered the bad news: Honda would only pay $900 toward the IMA replacement, leaving me on the hook for the rest, $1600. I asked him if he could help me out more, and that was the best they could do.

So, I'm screwed. Is there any hope of taking it to a different Honda dealer and getting it warrantied in full? My car issue is known to American Honda, so is it even worth the effort to try when the dealer contacts them?

I believe my best course of action would be to get a grid charger. Yet I still haven't been experiencing the problems others have had with the inherent IMA issues. In early March, before calling American Honda, I pulled the IMA fuse for a few minutes, and popped it back in. The errors have never returned, even after a 300+ mile road trip and around the town driving. Would the errors still be saved in the car's computer, or are they gone since I also disconnected the 12v battery?

So a followup question: is it possible there is actually no IMA problem, just a glitch in the error software?

Any ideas? Thoughts?

 

Sorry to hear it.

I would expect no better results from a different dealer. They're not going to eat it. The only reason you're getting anything is because Honda corporate is chipping in. Your VIN popping up from another dealer probably wouldn't get any better results.

IMHO, grid charging/discharging is the best option. Many experience additional years of proper function with grid charging/discharging once every 1-3 months. You can build your own for less than $100 or you can spend ~$450 for a discharge ready unit from Hybrid Automotive. The Hybrid Automotive option is a turnkey solution and powers the IMA fan while grid charging. The DIY option involves a lot of labor as it's safest to remove the pack from the car every time. The Hybrid Automotive option involves a one-time installation with detailed instructions on their website.

I would assess your current mileage and the frequency of recals. Frequent recals hurt mileage and indicate a weak or imbalanced battery. Once imbalanced, the pack only gets worse. The sooner you grid charge/discharge, the longer the life.

Steve

 

I've yet to see the warning lights come back, and last month I installed a grid charger.
From the instructions, the pack appears to be healthy and has been fully charged.
Everything is as normal as expected.