Avoid This Tire Problem
#11
09-11-2006, 09:09 AM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Originally Posted by gwilleford@satx.rr.com
Back in June i got a flat on my new car and I thought I would save a few dollars by replacing the one tire with a similar tire that was the same size but differnet tread pattern. Shortly after this change my car started running badly. High RPM's at 55 mph. To be exact it would stick around 3800 RPM's and not break until the car went under 50 mph. I took it to the dealer and they finaly admitted that there was a problem, but they didn't kniw how to fix it. They gave the car back to me and said they would get back to me when they had a fix.
Not satisfied with this I went through the process and filed a lemon law with txdot and demanded that my car be fixed within 30 days or replaced. On or near the thirtieth day I recieved a call from Honda asking if I would meet with the regional manager so that he could drive my car. Upon showing up, he looked at my car and had the service people to replace the one tire with one of the original tire. Wham! No more problem. My frusteration was that I had to file a lemon law case in order to get my car fixed.
On a positive note Honda has agreed to pay one of my car payments for all the problems that I had to go through. Who would have thought that a single tire would make such a difference.
In short, if you have to replace a tire make sure you replace both tires.
Not satisfied with this I went through the process and filed a lemon law with txdot and demanded that my car be fixed within 30 days or replaced. On or near the thirtieth day I recieved a call from Honda asking if I would meet with the regional manager so that he could drive my car. Upon showing up, he looked at my car and had the service people to replace the one tire with one of the original tire. Wham! No more problem. My frusteration was that I had to file a lemon law case in order to get my car fixed.
On a positive note Honda has agreed to pay one of my car payments for all the problems that I had to go through. Who would have thought that a single tire would make such a difference.
In short, if you have to replace a tire make sure you replace both tires.
I have to say the tire was not the correct size and maybe in the future you will learn to purchase the proper parts for your car instead of trying to save a buck and then try to blame Honda for your mistake.
I do hope Honda charged you for the tire, but it sounds like you not only took advantage of Honda by accepting a free car payment but also a free tire that you were not entitled to all because you made a poor choice by trying to be cheap.
I better stop now
, but it burns me up when people cause a problem and then demand that the manufacture pay for their mistakes, its time some people butch up and take responsibility.
#12
09-11-2006, 11:59 AM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
It sure has to do with the traction control or VSA, but they shouldn't be that sensitive. My other car has a calibration procedure you can go through when you replace the tires.
Also makes you wonder what happens when you have to use the spare one day.
Also makes you wonder what happens when you have to use the spare one day.
#13
09-11-2006, 01:12 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
The system probably has a mechanism that senses when you're using a spare so it takes that into account, since it knows exactly what tire size you are using (since they make the spares). Unless of course you tried using another spare....
#14
09-11-2006, 03:18 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Aren't you being overly harsh Captain? I think Gwilleford did the right thing since the dealer was stumped. I didn't see him say he bought a different size tire - I bet it was the same. And if it was that, you can't really blame some one who doesn't know that different model tires in the same size have circumfrences that can vary by several inches. Not all 195-65 R15's are created equal.
Seems to me Honda has a problem more than anyone. This scenario is sure to happen with more and more regularity as the HCHII fleet ages and will prove to be a pain in their rear. Considering that probably 99%+ of the cars and trucks on the road aren't hyper-sensitive to left-right tire diameter differences, you know that tire shops will contribute to this problem as other HCH's wear out tires. Some of these cars will end up back with Honda and cost them or the owner $$$ to fix it.
I think they should have made their control software a little more forgiving or intelligent enough to recognize the problem. Thanks Honda.
Seems to me Honda has a problem more than anyone. This scenario is sure to happen with more and more regularity as the HCHII fleet ages and will prove to be a pain in their rear. Considering that probably 99%+ of the cars and trucks on the road aren't hyper-sensitive to left-right tire diameter differences, you know that tire shops will contribute to this problem as other HCH's wear out tires. Some of these cars will end up back with Honda and cost them or the owner $$$ to fix it.
I think they should have made their control software a little more forgiving or intelligent enough to recognize the problem. Thanks Honda.
#15
09-11-2006, 03:31 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
This is all assuming, of course, that the traction control really was the problem. I'm still more likely to believe that the shop not rebalancing them properly than a different tread pattern or even slightly different wheel radii was the cause.
#16
09-11-2006, 05:10 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Thanks pal for the supportive words, but I think you missed the point.
1. If you read my posts I was passing on this information so others wouldn't make the same mistake I did.
2. I took my car in not realizing that the tire was the cause. Gilman Honda as well as their Tech department could not fix the problem, however they did recognize it.
3. Their solution was to start a case file and they would get back to me as soon as they had a solution. They wouldn't give me a time frame when the car would be fixed only that they would call me when they had a solution.
4. At this point I really thought there was something mechanical with the car and at that time I filed a Lemon Law case so that I would have the car fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Lemon states that it has to be fixed within 30 days.
5. I did purchase a new tire when the regional manager recognized that there was tire with a different tread pattern. I did question him how he knew to look at the tire as soon as he got there. He stated that they had another mediation case with the same problem. I stated that I was disappointed that the service department wasn't prevy to this information.
6. Without filing a Lemon Law case my car wouldn't be fixed and I wouldn't be passing this information other Hybrid owners.
7. The tire was the same size, just different tread patterns.
8. I never asked for anything from Honda other than having my car fixed. They offered the free car payment for all I had to go through.
9. Yes I am ignorant when it comes to tread patterns and how it will affect the engine, but so is all Honda's service department as well as the Honda's tech department.
10. When it appeared that the tire was the problem, I asked the regional manager to have the old tire to be put on the car so that we could be sure that this was the problem. I felt this was in the best interest for Honda and other hybrid owners. As soon as the other tire was placed on the car the problem came back. I returned the next and purchased the new tire.
10. My post was intended to help others from making the same mistake.
11. I am left wondering if I replace two tires with different tread patterns will this problem return. Will Honda owners be required to replace all the tires to avoid this problem.
1. If you read my posts I was passing on this information so others wouldn't make the same mistake I did.
2. I took my car in not realizing that the tire was the cause. Gilman Honda as well as their Tech department could not fix the problem, however they did recognize it.
3. Their solution was to start a case file and they would get back to me as soon as they had a solution. They wouldn't give me a time frame when the car would be fixed only that they would call me when they had a solution.
4. At this point I really thought there was something mechanical with the car and at that time I filed a Lemon Law case so that I would have the car fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Lemon states that it has to be fixed within 30 days.
5. I did purchase a new tire when the regional manager recognized that there was tire with a different tread pattern. I did question him how he knew to look at the tire as soon as he got there. He stated that they had another mediation case with the same problem. I stated that I was disappointed that the service department wasn't prevy to this information.
6. Without filing a Lemon Law case my car wouldn't be fixed and I wouldn't be passing this information other Hybrid owners.
7. The tire was the same size, just different tread patterns.
8. I never asked for anything from Honda other than having my car fixed. They offered the free car payment for all I had to go through.
9. Yes I am ignorant when it comes to tread patterns and how it will affect the engine, but so is all Honda's service department as well as the Honda's tech department.
10. When it appeared that the tire was the problem, I asked the regional manager to have the old tire to be put on the car so that we could be sure that this was the problem. I felt this was in the best interest for Honda and other hybrid owners. As soon as the other tire was placed on the car the problem came back. I returned the next and purchased the new tire.
10. My post was intended to help others from making the same mistake.
11. I am left wondering if I replace two tires with different tread patterns will this problem return. Will Honda owners be required to replace all the tires to avoid this problem.
#17
09-11-2006, 05:32 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Are you sure it was the tread pattern, it could be the weight of the tire. If the new tire is heavier then the other tires, I can see this adding to the problem.
Also, there are other factors too, just because the tire size is the same, doesn't mean that the circumference is the same under load (sounds odd right, but this is true). There are specs listed at tirerack.com that will show you this to be the case. If you list out the OEM tire and your replacement tire (full name)... you could check to see how different the specs are.
Also, there are other factors too, just because the tire size is the same, doesn't mean that the circumference is the same under load (sounds odd right, but this is true). There are specs listed at tirerack.com that will show you this to be the case. If you list out the OEM tire and your replacement tire (full name)... you could check to see how different the specs are.
#18
09-11-2006, 06:20 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Originally Posted by gwilleford@satx.rr.com
Thanks pal for the supportive words, but I think you missed the point.
1. If you read my posts I was passing on this information so others wouldn't make the same mistake I did. What was the problem? they put a original equipment tire back on it, was the circumference the problem?
2. I took my car in not realizing that the tire was the cause. Gilman Honda as well as their Tech department could not fix the problem, however they did recognize it. You stated they started a case file yet you filed a lemon law complaint against them when they did what they should have done, start a case file and work with Honda to find a solution.
3. Their solution was to start a case file and they would get back to me as soon as they had a solution. They wouldn't give me a time frame when the car would be fixed only that they would call me when they had a solution.
How could they give you a time frame for a problem that was not of Honda's making or Honda's fault?
4. At this point I really thought there was something mechanical with the car and at that time I filed a Lemon Law case so that I would have the car fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Lemon states that it has to be fixed within 30 days. Over reacting on your part because you thought it was Honda's fault, I wonder how the dealer feels about you as a customer now?
5. I did purchase a new tire when the regional manager recognized that there was tire with a different tread pattern. I did question him how he knew to look at the tire as soon as he got there. He stated that they had another mediation case with the same problem. I stated that I was disappointed that the service department wasn't prevy to this information.
If the other case is just now being investigated why in the world would Honda put out possibly wrong information to its dealers? By the way tread pattern would have no effect on your issue, the tires circumference would be an issue as the computer would know right away that the tire was of a different size and try to compensate for it, the computer would not have any clue as what the tread pattern looks like.
6. Without filing a Lemon Law case my car wouldn't be fixed and I wouldn't be passing this information other Hybrid owners. How do you know that, all you did was force the issue by filing a bogus lemon law complaint against Honda for a problem was not of their making and was your fault by your trying to save a few bucks on a tire instead of replacing the defective tire with one of the same make. Honda may have gotten back to you within a few days or a couple of weeks, we will never know.
7. The tire was the same size, just different tread patterns. Just because the size says P195/70/R15 does not mean that each manufactures tire is exactly the same diameter. The same P-size could be off by an inch or two between different manufactures. Once again the computer or the car does not care and does not know what your tread pattern looks like.
8. I never asked for anything from Honda other than having my car fixed. They offered the free car payment for all I had to go through. I would hope that you are writing Honda's head office and letting them know how they went above and beyond in your case.
9. Yes I am ignorant when it comes to tread patterns and how it will affect the engine, but so is all Honda's service department as well as the Honda's tech department. You are now making assumptions that are not based in fact, Honda did have some knowledge of this problem as you stated they told you they have one other car with the same problem. I bet there will soon be a TSB on this put out to all dealers now that they have found the problem. By the way you keep blaming the tires tread patteren, when your problem would have been caused by incorrect tire size, the computer system has no clue what the tread patteren looks like on any car.
10. When it appeared that the tire was the problem, I asked the regional manager to have the old tire to be put on the car so that we could be sure that this was the problem. I felt this was in the best interest for Honda and other hybrid owners. As soon as the other tire was placed on the car the problem came back. I returned the next and purchased the new tire. This statement just makes it sound like you know more then Honda about designing and building automobiles, You wanted the old tire put back on to make sure and you thought this would be best to benefit all other owners of Honda Hybrids and was in Honda's best interest to do this.
10. My post was intended to help others from making the same mistake. The problem with your post is you still do not know what the problem was, other then it involved the tire you bought. So any information you are bringing to light is really not of much value, but you can bet dollars to donuts that the tire problem was due to your replacement tire was of the wrong circumference, I can say without a doubt that the tread pattern has nothing to do with your problem as you keep alleging and thus putting out false information. False information dose nobody any good.
11. I am left wondering if I replace two tires with different tread patterns will this problem return. Will Honda owners be required to replace all the tires to avoid this problem.
1. If you read my posts I was passing on this information so others wouldn't make the same mistake I did. What was the problem? they put a original equipment tire back on it, was the circumference the problem?
2. I took my car in not realizing that the tire was the cause. Gilman Honda as well as their Tech department could not fix the problem, however they did recognize it. You stated they started a case file yet you filed a lemon law complaint against them when they did what they should have done, start a case file and work with Honda to find a solution.
3. Their solution was to start a case file and they would get back to me as soon as they had a solution. They wouldn't give me a time frame when the car would be fixed only that they would call me when they had a solution.
How could they give you a time frame for a problem that was not of Honda's making or Honda's fault?
4. At this point I really thought there was something mechanical with the car and at that time I filed a Lemon Law case so that I would have the car fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Lemon states that it has to be fixed within 30 days. Over reacting on your part because you thought it was Honda's fault, I wonder how the dealer feels about you as a customer now?
5. I did purchase a new tire when the regional manager recognized that there was tire with a different tread pattern. I did question him how he knew to look at the tire as soon as he got there. He stated that they had another mediation case with the same problem. I stated that I was disappointed that the service department wasn't prevy to this information.
If the other case is just now being investigated why in the world would Honda put out possibly wrong information to its dealers? By the way tread pattern would have no effect on your issue, the tires circumference would be an issue as the computer would know right away that the tire was of a different size and try to compensate for it, the computer would not have any clue as what the tread pattern looks like.
6. Without filing a Lemon Law case my car wouldn't be fixed and I wouldn't be passing this information other Hybrid owners. How do you know that, all you did was force the issue by filing a bogus lemon law complaint against Honda for a problem was not of their making and was your fault by your trying to save a few bucks on a tire instead of replacing the defective tire with one of the same make. Honda may have gotten back to you within a few days or a couple of weeks, we will never know.
7. The tire was the same size, just different tread patterns. Just because the size says P195/70/R15 does not mean that each manufactures tire is exactly the same diameter. The same P-size could be off by an inch or two between different manufactures. Once again the computer or the car does not care and does not know what your tread pattern looks like.
8. I never asked for anything from Honda other than having my car fixed. They offered the free car payment for all I had to go through. I would hope that you are writing Honda's head office and letting them know how they went above and beyond in your case.
9. Yes I am ignorant when it comes to tread patterns and how it will affect the engine, but so is all Honda's service department as well as the Honda's tech department. You are now making assumptions that are not based in fact, Honda did have some knowledge of this problem as you stated they told you they have one other car with the same problem. I bet there will soon be a TSB on this put out to all dealers now that they have found the problem. By the way you keep blaming the tires tread patteren, when your problem would have been caused by incorrect tire size, the computer system has no clue what the tread patteren looks like on any car.
10. When it appeared that the tire was the problem, I asked the regional manager to have the old tire to be put on the car so that we could be sure that this was the problem. I felt this was in the best interest for Honda and other hybrid owners. As soon as the other tire was placed on the car the problem came back. I returned the next and purchased the new tire. This statement just makes it sound like you know more then Honda about designing and building automobiles, You wanted the old tire put back on to make sure and you thought this would be best to benefit all other owners of Honda Hybrids and was in Honda's best interest to do this.
10. My post was intended to help others from making the same mistake. The problem with your post is you still do not know what the problem was, other then it involved the tire you bought. So any information you are bringing to light is really not of much value, but you can bet dollars to donuts that the tire problem was due to your replacement tire was of the wrong circumference, I can say without a doubt that the tread pattern has nothing to do with your problem as you keep alleging and thus putting out false information. False information dose nobody any good.
11. I am left wondering if I replace two tires with different tread patterns will this problem return. Will Honda owners be required to replace all the tires to avoid this problem.
Last edited by CaptJackSparrow; 09-11-2006 at 06:24 PM.
#19
09-11-2006, 06:41 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
Pal, it appears you are trying to yank my string. Call Jeff at Gilman Honda in San Antonio and he will support my claim. As for the legal aspect, cars must be fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Read your states Lemon Law. They vary from state to state. If you can't read I stated every time that the tire was the same size. Jeff will confirm this. If you need help finding the number for Gillman Honda do a search using google. You will get a hit. By the way, the people at Gillman were very supportive and understood my plight.
Once again this post was to help others....
Adios
Once again this post was to help others....
Adios
#20
09-11-2006, 06:58 PM
Re: Avoid This Tire Problem
One last thought about all the rebutle to my claims. Honda's regional service manager is the one that said it was the tread pattern. I was supprised as well as all the Mechanics at Gillman Honda that this would fix the car. You keep on claiming that it was a different size tire and all of us saw it was the same size tire. Give yourself some peace and call Jeff at Gillman to get the facts. I did wait two months to get my car fixed. How long would have it been without the Lemon Law? If they would have told me it was the tire upon going there I would have bought one that day.
