While this is all interesting, it should be a very sporadic and temporary condition.

It will only occur in a few locations, affecting a relatively small % of all Honda Civic owners.

A 130'F cutoff seems reasonable to me.
It is not Honda's fault.
It is a fact of physics and battery chemistry.

A solution is, do as Ford did in their Hybrid Escapes and run an A/C coil directly to the battery pack. It keeps the battery cool, but then those owners complain that the A/C load on the engine is dragging the MPG down. Plus it adds to vehicle cost.

Be reasonable.
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it too.
Driving in excessive is is not the same as driving in mild conditions.
Live with it, or get a traditional car with lower performance year round, but don't bash Honda.

 

Agreed, a cutoff is reasonable...but
Why wasn't my car reducing assist from day one?
How much damage has been done to my battery pack up to this point because the cutoff and inadequate air only cooling system that honda employs?
What indicators on my instrumentation tell me my battery pack is hot so I can expect diminished assist and regen so I can allow extra time to pull into traffic and to push harder on the brake pedal to stop in the same amount of time?

Coming from somebody that is living in 90+ days for the last couple of months, i can tell you that the issue is not a sporadic and temporary condition...the majority of my drive to and from work can be without assist post software update. If this is now considered a normal condition for the heat, perhaps honda shouldn't be selling these vehicles in these regions until they engineer a proper cooling system for the battery packs.

 

@ John,

I totally agree with your points.

Problems seem to result when the HCHII is operated in what I would call a "perfect Storm". Combine high ambient temperatures and cars parked all day in the sun, then make repeated stops in traffic under "auto-stop" with A/C going full blast, accelerate from those multiple stops using IMA assist and it's little wonder the battery pack gets "fried". The battery cooling system relies on cabin air and it simply can't cope with these extremes for an extended period of time.

To me, it's somewhat like when somebody hooks up a trailer and then drives up a mountain in 90 degree temperatures and wonders why their car overheats.

Cheers,

Roger

 

Not quite the same...
My wife's Honda odyssey's owners manually specifically states that your vehicle may overheat when climbing hills and towing a trailer due to the additional load. And that you have a coolant temperature gauge that tells you your car is overheating so you can make the proactive decision to slow down or pull to the side of the road and let the car cool down.

My honda civic hybrid's owner manual doesn't discuss the battery pack overheating and I do not have a battery temperature gauge that warns me that pack is overheating and to expect limited to no assist...we have to depend on the software in the car to determine these thresholds and the software has no way to indicate to the driver the decision its going to make next. Plus I don't tow a trailer everyday, only myself....now I know I've put a few pounds on since college, but come on!

I would have to wonder if Honda did thoroughly advertised that the battery packs cooling system was unable to keep up to maintain advertised performance levels, and that we would experienced constant diminished performance and lower MPGs in the heat how many people would have made an alternative purchasing decision?

 

@ Jason

You make a good point too. Perhaps we need some cleaver electronics-type to come up with a battery pack temperature gauge that we can observe when we fear the pack may be getting too hot.

As I was out driving my HCHII this afternoon, I noticed that the "climate control" system normally starts in the "recirc" mode when the car interior is already fairly warm before switching to the "fresh air" mode. Perhaps when we first start the car with an already hot interior, we should push the "fresh air" button to override the system. As I understand, this would then pressurize the interior and cause a greater flow of cooling air through the vents on the rear deck that supply the cooling for the IMA battery pack.

My earlier comments were being written as you were posting your last message. I do sympathize with people having these issues with their cars. Unfortunately Honda is trying to deal with the situation so the remainder of us who have been lucky so far, stay that way.

Cheers,

Roger

 

The Nissan Leaf has a dedicated temperature gauge for the battery pack from what I've seen of the reviews...as vehicles become dependent upon the battery packs for both acceleration AND cruising, its nice to see that they are recognizing this.

Interesting that Ford is using the A/C cooling coils to cool their packs in the Escape hybrid. Wonder if they are doing this in the Fusion as well. Gives me a lot more confidence in their product if they've engineered to that level.

 

I have recalls at 7AM when it's still cold outside, within 2 miles of home and with no real load on the car. I have recalls on my way back after the car has been parked 8h on a covered garage, every day. I have recalls with the AC ON so that the batteries are cooled down with the cabin air, and I have them with the AC OFF too. Sometimes I have them 2 times a day, on the way up and on the way down from work, some times just once a week. I for sure get them if the car is parked at home more than 2 days. I had them recently just after starting up the car, at 7AM, pulling out of my drive way entering the street, with a car coming from my right side and that scared the **** out of me as the car slooowly moved away. I had them on stop lights, with on ramps, 1/2 mile from my parking garage at work... I had them making left turns with oncoming traffic and right now I dont dare moving from the slow line to the line #2 after jumping on the freeway if a car is coming behind me with ANY speed, as I may not be able to pull forward.

On the other hand, I just came back from a 6000 mile trip on my AWD FEH, me, wife, 2 kids, luggage and outside temps over 100 at night, 115+ in Arizona, and humidity over 100% in Florida... did Los Angeles to Las Vegas, Vegas to Alburquerque, Amarillo, Memphis, Down to Orlando, FL, Savahnna GA, Atlanta, Kentucky, Springfield, Il, Denver, CO, Utah, then down to Las Vegas and back to Los Angeles, in 2 weeks. Not a single problem. Even going up from Denver towards the Eisenhower tunnel the car did great (slow, mind you, there, but just fine) No power losses, AC on at 1 notch most of the time. Beautiful. $526 in gas for the whole 6000 miles. My work place paid for it and the people at the office could not believe it after adding up all receipts. And my HCH scares the **** out of me several times a month. I dont trust it. And then, it can be just fine for a few days but it goes back to the same again. Summer or winter. I do around 38MPG on the 2006HCH, and 30MPG on the AWD FEH... Average on the FEH, calculated, was 30MPH for the whole Los Angeles to FLorida, Illinois and back to los Angeles trip, with actually "iddling the car" to keep the AC going when we stopped for a few hours on the rest areas every day. I first thought the drop in mileage was due to the use of the carpool and the faster speed. On stop and go traffic, the car did much better. No longer the case. Havent used the carpool for over a year, and milleage is terrible. Had a 2003HCH before, changed after 3 years for this then new 2006, and I wish I had gone with a Prius.

BTW, I left the HCH at home during those 2 weeks. The day I came back the car used the started to crank up the engine. First time I heard it.

I just hope the battery dies soon or I will trade this car next year. I dont do it now because I cannot afford it. Of couse, this thing began doing it badly just after I had changed from Lease to Purchase at the end of the lease...

My commute is from Reseda, CA to Glendale, CA, 22 miles each way. No big hills just stop an go traffic many days, but the car did its best on that when new.

 

I have recals every 2-3 minutes of driving the car.

Have you had the software update yet? Don't hope for the battery to die because Honda likely won't replace it, even under warranty. Mine only charges to a few bars at most and the dealer says they won't do anything because it is still working.

"Working normally" according to them is going from 4 bars to zero, hesitating for a few seconds, then showing one bar and working it's way back up to three or four before crashing again.

 

In Michigan, my 2006 HCH clearly experienced poor performance due to heat. By heat, I mean temperatures only around 90 degrees for part of the day and not using air conditioning the first few minutes after I started the car. Honda has a flaw in their physics and battery chemistry. This is a major problem for Honda. I traded in my 2006 HCH for a 2010 Prius - significantly higher mpg, better acceleration, no recals. If Honda would've recalled their faulty control arms and seriously address the hybrid battery issue, I probably would've kept my 2006 HCH. With the way Honda is dealing with these issues, it's not worth the risk of major expense. Part of the hybrid experience is being green and the other part is supposed to be long-term cost savings.

It's possible the newer HCHII model years have advances that will help prevent issues or it's also possible that some HCHII owners haven't driven their car enough miles to experience the issues. I put 129,000 miles on my 2006 HCHII.

 

"It's possible the newer HCHII model years have advances that will help prevent issues or it's also possible that some HCHII owners haven't driven their car enough miles to experience the issues. I put 129,000 miles on my 2006 HCHII."

NOPE.....

I have a 2009 HCH II. I replaced my 1st battery in March 2010 after 12 months and only 10,000 miles, and now only 6 months later, I'm having issues with the second battery.....