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NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?

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  #11  
Old 03-01-2011, 01:21 PM
jdenenberg's Avatar
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by Longwing
Still quite a bit mystified by the cryptic instructions on checking the eCVT fluid on the Altima Hybrid. A google of the "Nissan Matic W" term led me to the 09-059 service bulletin specifying you must definitely use the W type and not the D, J, or S types most dealerships have for regular CVTs but did not point out the specification or particular equivalents for the W type (a Moss-Magnuson conflict I would think). Then the maintenance and service manuals have a dizzying array of conditions and mileages when one might "Inspect" the fluid versus "Replace" the fluid. The "Inspect" only seems to be a "sufficient level of fluid" inspection and does not indicate checking for color or (god forbid) drawing a sample and sending off to a lab. From TM23 and TM35 I cannot figure how one could get at the side of the transaxle to pull out the little filler plug to just have a look and there is no indication what part number the little gaskets are that must be replaced with every fluid inspection. The inspection seems to be every 15K miles but no clear indication of any replacement ever. If one were to be towing a trailer a lot or "driving on rough/muddy roads" then the 15K interval is a replacement interval. Any comments on how long I could just ignore the whole thing?
Your NAH has a Toyota Hybrid system. We (a group of engineering types that own Prii) have been doing ATF testing and have determined that it is a good idea to do periodic drain/refills of the Type WS (Toyota's nomenclature) ATF. Our consensus is do an early refresh at 30k miles and then every 60k miles thereafter. If I owned a NAH I would follow that program to enhance the life of the eCVT.

JeffD
 
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  #12  
Old 03-02-2011, 05:18 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by jdenenberg
Your NAH has a Toyota Hybrid system. We (a group of engineering types that own Prii) have been doing ATF testing and have determined that it is a good idea to do periodic drain/refills of the Type WS (Toyota's nomenclature) ATF. Our consensus is do an early refresh at 30k miles and then every 60k miles thereafter. If I owned a NAH I would follow that program to enhance the life of the eCVT.

JeffD

What is the nomenclature for the NAH fluid that is comparable to the Toyota Type WS?

Can this drain/refill be done by any shop? Or, should I take it the Nissan dealer?

Thanks!
 
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  #13  
Old 03-02-2011, 06:37 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by cephraim
What is the nomenclature for the NAH fluid that is comparable to the Toyota Type WS?
See post #3 at:
http://x.nissanhelp.com/forums/altim...ma-hybrid.html
It is from a Nissan Master tech and he knows better than I.

ALERT: Here is a bulletin from Nissan on this subject
http://www.nissanassist.com/web/docu..._059_FINAL.pdf
It is quite specific. Only use Nissan Matic W ATF in a NAH.
Can this drain/refill be done by any shop? Or, should I take it the Nissan dealer?
The drain and refill is a reasonable DIY on a Prius. You need to have on hand the correct ATF fluid and new gaskets for the fill and drain plugs. The instructions posted at PriusChat should be appropriate for your NAH with minor variations, but you or your mechanic will have to look at your NAH physical layout carefully. There are two important points:
  1. Loosen the fill plug first to make certain that you can open it before opening the drain plug.
  2. Be careful not to open the coolant drain as getting air bubbles out of the inverter coolant loop can be difficult.
My Toyota dealer charges about $100 (I have seen a wide variation in dealer pricing) for the ATF drain/refill and the gallon of ATF required costs almost half of that so I just let the dealer do it for me. Ask your Nissan dealer what the charge is for a drain/refill, not a flush. If they are reasonable, let them do it for you. Good luck.

JeffD
 
Last edited by jdenenberg; 03-02-2011 at 08:14 AM.
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  #14  
Old 03-02-2011, 09:41 AM
cephraim's Avatar
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by jdenenberg
See post #3 at:
http://x.nissanhelp.com/forums/altim...ma-hybrid.html
It is from a Nissan Master tech and he knows better than I.
I knew that post looked familiar! I started that thread!

Thanks for the additional info!

Eph
 
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  #15  
Old 03-03-2011, 05:33 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Just spoke with my dealer. They said that a drain/fill only exchanges about 4 of the ~12 quarts in the CVT. Does that sound right?
 
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  #16  
Old 03-03-2011, 06:28 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by cephraim
Just spoke with my dealer. They said that a drain/fill only exchanges about 4 of the ~12 quarts in the CVT. Does that sound right?
NO! Your dealer (actually just the person trying to upsell you to a flush - more $$$) is saying something that is true for most automatic transmissions, but not an eCVT. They don't have equipment to flush the eCVT and a drain/refill will get out about 80% of the old fluid (some will remain in recessed passages). That is enough according to our lab testing.

Attached is a pdf file that shows 4 lab tests (Virgin Type WS, Prius at 61k, Prius at 120k and Prius at 180k) to show your dealer.

JeffD
 
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
RGLabs-180kATF.pdf (34.4 KB, 751 views)
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  #17  
Old 03-03-2011, 06:35 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
So, how many quarts are in our eCVT and how many do you believe are required for a drain/refill (what are the numbers that get to the 80%)?

Thanks for the lab results! Holy crap!
What it doesn't show (I think) is the mileage at each of those samples. Am I missing that?

Thanks!
 
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  #18  
Old 03-03-2011, 09:00 AM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Originally Posted by cephraim
So, how many quarts are in our eCVT and how many do you believe are required for a drain/refill (what are the numbers that get to the 80%)?
My Prius takes just under a gallon. Your NAH may be more like the tranny in a TCH, but I don't know that capacity.
Thanks for the lab results! Holy crap!
The first used oil at 61k miles (when I found the group analyzing classic Prius ATF) shows a lot of silicates (probably from the sealants used to assemble the tranny) as well as too much Iron and Aluminum content from wear on the gears. Later analysis shows much fewer suspended particles (the gears are now smoother and less wear) as well as a little better change in viscosity (The lab says that a 15% viscosity change says the oil is used up)
What it doesn't show (I think) is the mileage at each of those samples. Am I missing that?
Yes you are. The mileage at each test is at the top of each column (subtract to tell how many miles on each sample).

JeffD
 
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  #19  
Old 07-14-2012, 02:23 PM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
Ya maintenance schedule just keeps saying Inspect ecvt fluid never anything about replacing it.only way to inspect is by a diagnostics check at dealer?or can an OBD check it?There is no dipstick on my 2009.
 
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  #20  
Old 07-14-2012, 03:20 PM
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Default Re: NAH - How to check CVT transmission fluid?
The eCVT ATF check is to open the fill hole and feel for the fluid level (nearly topped off). This only detects leaking ATF, a rare occurrence. You should drain and refill the eCVT every 60,000 miles (once after the first 30,000 miles is a good idea).

JeffD
 
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