Does anyone know the proper range of the 35 hybrid specific monitors in the OBD II for the Tahoe/Yukon/Escalade etc.? I have never really gotten a definitive answer, even the Hybrid tech at the dealer was unsure, he apparently just compares them to whatever is in the GM computer.

It's pretty well known what the ranges are for the Prius, and I have always assumed they would be the same or similar for the Tahoe....but it occurred to me i'm jut not sure.

Below is a screenshot of the 35 hybrid specific custom PID's on Torque Pro. ( I made them tiny so I can see all 35 at one time)

TIA

 

They are the same. They are the exact same modules. The thing is there is no such range at least not available to the public nor to the dealer. The voltage values depend on:

1. State of charge of the 12 cells in the block (which probably aren't exactly the same)
2. Temperature
3. Current (magnitude)
4. Direction of current flow (charge or discharge)

Based on what I see:

13.8 - 14.1V not good as HB Amps is reporting 0A, which means those are resting voltages, which means your battery is completely depleted. This conflicts with the car reported SoC of 54.5%, which suggests that something is being reported incorrectly. Assuming the DPA reported 17.3 kW is an accurate representation of the load, that suggests about 60A was being pulled at the time. If so, the numbers are pretty good as 60A will definitely pull the voltage down nicely.

The more important criterion is total voltage deviation between the highest and lowest block. THAT is more telling. Also, while I realize you may have cut it back for visibility, XX.XX voltage accuracy is more telling. I might be seeing 13.84V to 14.05V - which is a little less concerning.

Toyota repair manual diagnostics call for high current load and charge operations while monitoring total block voltage deviation. Anything over 0.3V can trigger a failure.

 

I knew the modules are the same as a Prius and should be the same ranges....I was thinking about the 15 other parameter ranges GM provides.(I'm not sure which of those Toyota provides, maybe all of them)

I was just curious about the proper ranges because it occurred to me that I have been interpreting the data from torque for several years now.....possibly not entirely correctly since I don't actually know the proper ranges(not just for the modules but the other parameters as well).

FYI, I am soon replacing this Traction battery because it has lived a full life, 10 years/185K miles in the Arizona heat and I'm tired of playing module wack a mole. Several of the pairs drop below 10V after heavy use....and that's not a good sign. They charge right back up but drop off a cliff....pretty typical for any worn out battery.

This particular screen shot was after some light city driving with the AC on, I was sitting still preparing to park, in auto stop with the AC running. This was only provided as an example as it looks totally different after driving on the expressway, in bumper to bumper traffic or with the ICE on. I have several screen shots taken the same day that you would swear could not be from the same vehicle.

The SOC bounces all over from 30-70, which Probably is due to the battery being completely worn out. I believe static 60 is a desirable SOC for a Prius....wasn't sure if it is the same for GM.

I regularly see voltage variations from neighboring modules of one pair at 15V, and one at 10V. in auto stop...they all jump to 17/18V+ when the ICE starts. It's blows my mind that auto stop still even functions....it cannot maintain auto stop with the AC of for more than a minute, it's comical to see the gauges drop of a cliff.

It's painfully obvious this battery is having trouble storing energy because everything looks great at expressway speeds or shortly after exiting....however the figures fall off a cliff in city driving where a hybrid should shine(and this one used to).

 

Again, there are essentially no "proper" ranges for the block voltage values. For a given cell temperature, a given state of charge, and a given current value, there is an expected exact voltage. Technically, it works the other way. For a given current, and temperature, the block voltages are used to compute SoC. Think of a table with currents in the first column, and 2 through n columns that contain block voltage. If Current, A results in Voltage, V; adjust V for temp, Vt; go to the top of that voltage column and read the SoC value. Do this for all 20 blocks and average to compute overall SoC. There are multiple layers of rules for operation on top of that.

If you were running A/C with a typical 8A load, those numbers are atrocious.

Whack-a-mole is no fun. What's the plan for replacement? Are you going new?

 

I haven't decided what I'm going to do for the replacement, obviously new is the best option since I plan on keeping the vehicle for the foreseeable future.

There's a Catch 22 with sourcing a new one, because of the weight and the core I have to get it locally or somewhere I can drive to, most GM dealers in the Phoenix area won't sell or even order one....they just don't want to be bothered with it. The couple of dealers that would order one say it's on national back order, has been for several months and has no delivery date in the system. They will not order one without full payment and my VIN number. I have a slight issue with giving them $3700 for a part that they aren't even sure if and when they can get.... and they aren't real anxious to discount it.

I thought about having a competent hybrid guy rebuild the battery....but I know that likely will not last, if i'm lucky a couple years.

I'll probably go with Green Bean for the warranty....the warranty what I'll be paying for because I strongly suspect a rebuilt battery will not last 5 years. They have good reviews and the business model is growing, I feel confident they won't disappear, although I am aware that is a distinct possibility.

I considered just trading it in for a new Tahoe but I like this one, I purchased it new so I'm attached to it....and the new ones are like 60K+, I'd rather not.

I need to figure something out soon because the Arizona registration expires 9/30 , the emission are due and it will not pass with that little yellow reminder "get me a new traction battery" . Oh, it's been telling me for about a year now it wants a new battery....which is amazing because from what I understand a Prius will not drive with a bad battery.

 

I can't find the thread/posts, but someone on here ordered one online, had it shipped to him and returned his core to a local dealership. It wasn't much more than GB.



Here are my thoughts about a 5 year warranty:

Count on 1-2 replacements. This means a 100-200% warranty rate for a 50-70% premium.


Dorman, the 100 year old parts supplier, purchased Hybrid ReInvolt. They offered 3 year warranties.

Had they not had the deep pockets of a $2 billion parent company, they would have gone belly up. Their quality took a nosedive. They started putting Gen1 modules (could buy 38 gen1 modules in a Gen1 pack for less than Gen2 packs) in Gen2 packs and were experiencing extremely high warranty rates - this from a well-funded company with YEARS of experience and HISTORY doing this work.


GB hasn't been around two years yet. They've experienced extreme growth and expansion in that time. They went from pro-rated to full 5 year warranty in less than a year's time with no long-term data.

IMHO, with a baked-in 100-200% warranty rate, they are going to be buried in warranties in 1-3 years, and they will be making choices to either sell new batteries for revenue and to keep the doors open or support warranties. imagine that... 2-3 batteries per customer, 2-3 batteries tested/built/installed for each customer for every sale - at a 50-70% premium over typical offerings.

Dorman proved that a 3 year warranty wasn't viable with $2 billion deep pockets. I don't think it's reasonable to expect a relatively small company that has grown/expanded very fast won't encounter exactly the same challenges as Dorman. Without those deep pockets, it's not likely to survive, and it will likely include customers waiting for warranty replacements for weeks/months.