To quote the article:

As an example, he cites an instance when GM and Ford customers rejected upgrades in the rear suspensions of Camaros and Mustangs because aficionados liked the feel of their "ride" just the way it was.



Maybe it's time for Ford & GM to stop telling us what we want and start listening.

Also, people are naturally resistant to change when it's presented to them as such. Do what you know is right, do a good job of it, and people will buy it. You may lose some customers, but you may gain others. It's what defines a leader, and that's why Toyota's pulling into #1.

 

Well said, it is a fine line between letting focus groups design the cars, and taking focus groups into consideration while the experts design the cars. I doubt many Camaro and Mustang owners would have complained about their cars handling had the upgrade to an independant rear suspension been made. I won't even get into pushrod engines, which GM is still clinging to because of their 'simplicity' and 'torque'.

 

Which means vehicles that one starts to hate a couple of miles after one has left the parking lot.

The only exception I can remember is on a trip to Disneyland with a large party of people. I rented an extended cab Ford Aerostar, which I liked so much that 5 months later I bought one. It had a 4.0L V6 with the right balance of power and fuel economy.
Or was the Orlando breeze that gave me that impression?

 

I wonder what ever happened to Ford's tiny/cute cars -- the Festiva and the Aspire. I rented an Aspire once and thought it was a neat little car.

 

Must've been a serious breeze from Orlando to hit you all the way over in Anaheim.

 

I don't know about all of you, but I think American car companies have a main problem.

Betrayal. At a time in my life when we were a single income family with two babies and things were tight, I trusted Chryster with $15,000 of my hard-earned money for our family vehicle. What I got was 6 years and 50K miles where almost every part that mattered failed, in some cases multiple times. I had to replace the entire exhaust system, the entire brake system, three transmissions, radio, multiple alignments, multiple tune ups, and over 10 recalls, some serious. I delt with dealers in multiple states that committed repeated acts of fraud. They routinely charged for repairs not done and parts that were not replaced. At a time when money was tight, this car - and the dealierships supporting it - were killing me. When the third transmission was failing, I had to trade out of it, and yet again, endure financial hard-times getting into a replacement vehicle.

I have family and friends that can tell you the same story about their American cars. Now every car line has the occasional lemon. However these were serious, underlying engineering flaws common to the whole product line. Maybe in the 60's these short-comings were charming and added personality. That was when most folks could successfully tinker with their car.

I'll give them that quality seems better in this decade, however that hasn't erased the past. It doesn't heal the wound left by 5 years of my continual attempt to trust them, their continual betrayal of that trust. The chances of Ford, Chrystler or GM getting another penny from me are zero unless they figure out a way for me to trust them again.

 

I know many people feel this way, and most of them for good (albeit painful, first-hand experience) reasons. That said, some of my parents best vehicles over the years have been American made, and even their lemon (in my eyes; my Mom loves hers, despite it all) Chevy Camaros mostly died during warranty -- completely new transmission and the like, as you describe. That is why *I* won't ever own a Chevrolet. Spending the kind of money we all do on a vehicle is personal. It's a big deal. When we get burned, it hurts, bad, and it leaves a scar.

I similarly disliked Ford after watching my then-boyfriend (now husband of 8 years) try to coax his Ford Ranger Splash 4x4 to behave. It never left us stranded, but it did have things like the 4x4 system fail to work, the passenger side window failed to roll back up *in a Texas thunderstorm*, leaving me soaked during a drive back from the Texas coast (funny, now; but he's lucky I still spoke to him after that experience!)

But then a funny thing happened. I realized everyone I knew, almost, had Fords. Granted, my brother's and Dad's are brand new (2005 Ford Mustangs; Dad went for the GT to replace his Chevy Camaro; yes, both my folks had Camaros, both red, in fact.) I realized my husband's 2001 Ford F-150 Supercrew 4x4 was doing splendidly, as was his brother's and his father's (all same relative model year.)

Having driven a Toyota (Corolla) for 14 years, it was hard for me to consider "buying American" because of the same things you mention and some of my past experiences/observations. But I did, and I love my Ford Escape Hybrid. I have found nothing that makes me regret that decision, although I admit I'm a little more sensitive than a Ford-loyal person might be. I've been known to utter, "Don't you do anything goofy on me, baby!" and that's talking to my hybrid, not my hubby.

So many of the foreign automakers build cars here in the USA that I really don't think the difference between US and foreign autos is as big as it once. If anything, there's probably more cross-flow of ideas and skills (from the foreign makers to the U.S. automakers) and that's benefitting us all.

Just my inflated 2 cents.

 

yeah.... it was a tailwind, so I got excellent MPG...

But you are right, it wasn't Disneyland, it was Disneyworld

 

Thank you for your story! I was sort of angrier before. I know a lot of friends who do very well with their GM/Ford/Chrystler (newer ones ). I drove a Pontiac G6 as a rental too long ago and was very impressed.I really want to like the Ford Fusion, and hope the hybrid is a winner. I don't wish them ill-will or anything (well, not GM or Ford anyway...just kidding).

Here's what I don't get. Clearly Americans know how to manufacture well (to your point that many foreign cars are assembled here). Americans know how to engineer - I work with tons of them who build things so complex it makes cars look like Hot Wheels. So we can do that too. So why is it the "lemon stories" seem so lopsided? I can think of 8 people I personally know right now who have had something major and pre-mature fail on their American truck/SUV in the last year. I don't know any Honda/Toyota owner with a story like that going back 5 or more years (except the guy from Canada (forget the name) who seem to had a miserable run with his Insight).

In my experience when things aren't built correctly, it's not because we didn't know better, we weren't allowed to do better for one reason or another (usually tied to budget or schedule). That's a leadership problem to me.

 

Tim,

I think the root problem is Detroit has an antiquated management system that is stuck in the 1960's AND they are dealing with the UAW's demands with an unsustainable health and retirement package. If they had let go of this a decade ago, Detroit would be in much better shape now.