My 2008 Camry hybrid has 125,000 miles. I have followed all required periodic maintenance, etc., changing the 12V battery a couple of years ago.
The car runs great.
I'm just wondering about the performance (and life span) of the traction battery. I live in northern NJ, so the car gets to enjoy wintertime weather, including periodic sub freezing temperatures, although it's garaged each night.
I've heard that some ancient Prius' easily cruised passed 200,000 miles.
Are there any old aged hybrid owners here?
What's your experience (or knowledge) regarding the life span of the battery (or individual cells)? If there's an issue with a cell, will I get a 'yellow light'?
Thanks!

 

Temperature plays a huge role. Most batteries last 10-12 years with little consideration for mileage. Some never die, some die at 30K miles.

I've seen a 2005 Prius that lived life as a regular car to 120K miles, assumed life as a taxi at that point and went to 386K miles. Can't know for certain, but date information on car and pack are consistent with it being the original. I just encountered a Gen2 with 289K miles that lived its entire life in Phoenix. The battery was effectively destroyed and could not be reconditioned, but it made it that far. Very atypical.

Your failure risk is much more likely due to the age of the battery. Conservative driving with at least 3-4 drives per week will help. One of the worst things you can do is let it sit.

 

Thanks, get's plenty of exercise, I have a 7 mile commute drive 5-6 days a week.
Does the battery die all at once...or do you notice issues with certain cells reduced mileage (do you get yellow lights?)

 

7 miles is pretty marginal. Your commute mileage based on a standard work week (52 weeks/year, 5 days per week) is only 3640mi/year. Hopefully, you're stretching its legs every 1-2 weeks.

The pack fails in one of two ways:
1) cell failure. One of the 17 blocks will report low voltage, and the car will object strongly and perform noticeably poorly.
2) capacity failure - battery has degraded to where it can only store a small fraction of its rated capacity - below the threshold the car needs to properly function. This failure is gradual and appears out of nowhere coupled with, "but it's driving fine!"

If #1 is the triggering event, it's typically in conjunction with #2, i.e., the rest of the battery is significantly degraded. There is usually no warning unless you habitually watch the battery gauge and notice it is filling and emptying faster.

#2 may be preceded by a noticeable reduction in mpg, but that depends on the type of driving. 50% or more city driving is more likely to yield a significant change. it. If it's a freeway queen, then you may not notice it at all.

You can assess your battery health via:

$20 Bluetooth OBDII adapter (each app has its own recommendations)
Dr. Prius for iPhone
Hybrid Assistant for Android.

Both of those solutions enable you to see the 17 block voltages and provide guidance for estimating the pack's state of health.

The test is not predictive. Technically, you could have a #1 failure the next time you drive the car regardless of the test results. But generally, a battery that tests reasonably healthy is unlikely to pose a short term failure risk.

 

We have a guy at toyotanation that has his 07 TCH closing on 300 000 miles. He JUST got to the point, when he needs to replace cell packs. Otherwise, according to him, all original. Forgot who it is - either snookwhaler or lincolnshibuya. Actually, even sent me picture of his odo once.

How to know when hybrid battery is failing
What causes hybrid batteries to degrade and fail?

Eventually all batteries will fail. Hybrid Electric Vehicle (HEV) NiMh batteries have a life cycle. When the hybrid battery does not last as long as the rest of the vehicle, replacing it costs several thousand dollars and creates hazardous environmental waste. Delaying battery failure beyond the service life of the vehicle will reduce the negative environmental impact of hybrid vehicle ownership and save the vehicle owner thousands of dollars.
This graph depicts the typical life cycle of a Hybrid Electric Vehicle (HEV) hybrid battery:

There are three major phases of hybrid battery lifespan. Usable capacity and performance decreasing as the battery ages:
Typically begins: Typically ends: Phase 1: Healthy hybrid battery New Vehicle 3-6 years Phase 2: Weakened/weakening hybrid battery 3-6 years 5-11 years Phase 3: "Failed" hybrid battery (DTC code present) 5-11 years

Each hybrid battery 'pack' is comprised of many individual battery cells. Consumer hybrid electric vehicles have anywhere from 120 to 240 individual battery cells. Each cell is about the size of a typical D cell battery. At the beginning of the hybrid battery’s life, each cell easily provides all of the energy needed to propel the vehicle and to stay in sync with other cells in the battery pack. As time progresses, the battery will start to degrade and the cells will fall out of sync with each other. Results of this degradation include:
(1) usable cell capacity is reduced
(2) cells drift out of balance with each other (voltage delta).
The speed of this deterioration is determined by a variety of factors, including vehicle make/model, climate, driving habits, variation in battery cell construction, and more.
This battery deterioration means that the individual cells within the battery pack can have a different charge level and capacity - they are no longer 'in sync' with each other. Some cells can be 'full' while other cells in the same battery pack are 'empty'. The overall battery pack performance is limited by the vehicle's battery management system to the weakest cell when discharging and the strongest cell while charging. As a result, the wider the cell imbalance, the narrower the usable range of the hybrid battery becomes. The car's battery management system uses only a limited range of the battery cells actual physical capacity (80%-40% for Toyota and 80%-20% for Honda). As the usable capacity decreases and the cells become further and further out of balance with each other, the vehicle us able to use less and less of the batteries actual capacity. The vehicle cannot correct this imbalance problem on its own. The car cannot force the cells back into balance with each other.
If no attention is given to the hybrid battery, it will 'fail' and the check engine light/hybrid battery light will be illuminated.


How do I know if my hybrid battery is failing?





There are several subtle cues displayed by a hybrid vehicle that can alert you to degrading hybrid battery capacity & performance. If not acted upon, the battery will ultimately display a fault code for battery 'failure'. By paying attention to the warning signs and performing preventative care on the battery before it 'fails', you can easily improve battery health and prolong its life. Prolong Battery Systems will improve hybrid battery performance, save you thousands of dollars in avoided replacement hybrid battery costs, and benefit the environment by requiring one less hybrid battery to be manufactured. (Note: The symptoms described below are applicable to Toyota vehicles. Honda vehicles display similar symptoms. Feel free to give us a call and we can describe the Honda symptoms for you.)

The first indication of decreased battery performance is a reduction on fuel economy and diminished vehicle performance. The vehicle does not get the same fuel mileage that it used to and it feels sluggish - lacking in power during acceleration. If equipped, EV mode may be less frequent and for shorter duration then when the vehicle was newer. This happens because as the hybrid battery weakens, the vehicle is forced to use less of the battery and more of the gas engine. It also spends more time charging the hybrid battery in the background (i.e. not shown on the dash). Both of these behaviors reduce fuel economy. This can last for several months as the battery weakens and fuel economy/performance progressively decreases. Note: sometimes under inflated tires can cause similar symptoms. We recommend checking your tire pressure to be sure that is not the cause of decreased fuel economy.

The second warning that your hybrid battery is failing is called negative battery recalibrations. This is initially seen when parking the car for a few days (such as over a weekend) or when parking the vehicle overnight. Just before the vehicle is parked, the dash battery display shows a full or near full hybrid battery. When the car is started the next morning (or a few mornings later) the battery display shows an empty or near empty battery. The empty battery indication can be displayed immediately when the car is started or drop from full to empty in the first few minutes of operating the vehicle. This occurs most often in warmer climates or seasons, but as the battery degrades will happen in any climate. This is a clear sign of a weak battery that needs attention soon. If ignored, the battery will soon progress to the point of failure. If treated with Prolong Battery Systems before the battery degrades further, the success rate for recovering the pack and restoring it to good operating condition is nearly 100%.
The third and final warning the vehicle displays of a failing hybrid battery is negative recalibrations that occur while the vehicle is being operated. These recalibrations often occurs on warm days or when idling the vehicle for longer periods (such as waiting for a parking spot or railroad crossing), but as the battery weakens can happen at any time. These are seen as the dashboard battery charge display suddenly dropping from near full to near empty. This drop is followed by the gasoline engine revving to a higher than normal idle speed while force charging the battery from empty to full. This event is easily visible on the dashboard battery display and can be audibly heard by the loud, unusual high idling of the gasoline engine. This can be very unsettling behavior as the vehicle seems to ‘take over’ and ignore driver inputs while force re-charging the battery. This is a red flag, serious battery issues are imminent. In these cases, we strongly recommend using the Prolong Battery Reconditioning Package to perform a preventative battery reconditioning as soon as possible. Ignoring these symptoms for more than a few weeks will result in the battery displaying a failure code and being stranded on the side of the road. If treated with Prolong Battery Systems as soon as these symptoms become present, the success rate for recovering the pack and restoring it to good operating condition is nearly 90%.
The next phase of battery failure is a failure light on the dash and cell failure. Our products can still help vehicle owners in this situation, but the success rate depends on how long it has been since the failure first appeared. If this describes your car, please give us a call to discuss your specific situation and learn how much our products can help you and your hybrid vehicle battery.


https://hybridautomotive.com/pages/faq

 

Mine is a 2008. I have had it practically since new. Bought it used at Lexus of Palm Beach with under 40,000 miles. Car was a trade in for a new Lexus. The traction battery finally gave up the ghost last year at 282,200 miles. Ironically the original 12v battery gave up the month prior to the traction battery failure! LOL... Go figure. So 11 years on both batteries. Not too bad IMO.

I got a deal on an original Panasonic 12v battery from the dealer. So no issues there. It was $220 out the door. I installed it myself. Took about 10 minutes.

The traction battery failure was another story. I took it upon myself to the revitalize the individual modules with hobby chargers and got it up and running again in a few weeks after the failure. I was unable to get all the modules back up to the original spec. Actually a little more than half on all of them. Some of them were extremely weak. Lots of corrosion across all of the bus bars and terminals. Honestly knowing what I know now, I would have found a newer low mileage Prius battery pack and just rebuilt the pack with those modules. As "S Keith" has said many times, "the TCH really hammers the modules" over time and it just makes sense to replace them rather than try and bring them back. That said, the car now has 296,400 miles and no issues at all since the traction battery overhaul. It's almost been 1.5 years now.

FYI. There really is no warning of the failure, it just happens. I expect that with the age of your car and knowing what I know about the corrosion problem, you are definitely on borrowed time. Start preparing for it now IMO.

On a more positive note, the car still has all the original brake pads and rotors and at 296,000 miles the front pads have about 60 percent pad left and the rears about 40 percent left. For years I was religious about pulling the wheels and cycling the caliper pistons to be sure they were not seized. I also used to pull and lube the caliper slide pins every 30,000 miles or so. It's paid off. I'm convinced the pads and rotors will easily make it to 400,000 miles. Crazy...

 

What do you mean exactly when you say " performing preventative care on the battery before it 'fails' "

I have looked all over and cannot find any information on preventative care for the hybrid battery.... can you be more specific? Thanks!

 

Did you visit the website in the post you quoted? That's what they're all about. Your exact question is answered on the FAQ page.

 

Thanks,

I noticed they are selling a product.

Do you have personal experience with it?

 

Did you get your question answered?