CopyBoy1,

Please report back on the diagnosis as well as fix, some of us are keeping track of FEH problems to assist others who report problems. Doubt these apply, but here are several examples:

* One guy reported his Check Engine light came on and message read "Emission System". Turns out he had just replaced the FEH gas cap with locking cap and it did not seal good enough; problem could also occur if not getting gas cap on fully.

*One gal had multiple error lights that got worse over two days, starting with "Check Brakes" progressing to "System Alert/Caution". The cause turned out to be an electrical harness screw fell off, where the wires then frayed from movement and shorted-out systems. First they replaced her electrical drive train and voltage converter before finding problem source. Ford bought her vehicle back after a couple weeks in shop and replaced with a new one.

* Other than that, only other major problems were early 2005 FEH Steering Control Module failures and a few ABS Hydraulic Control Valve replacements.

Note: One case of very low MPG turned out to be from owner replacement of the low-rolling resistance tires and light weight alloy wheels with heavier/larger wheels.

Be sure to ask for loaner car if they keep in shop for any duration. So far, Ford Dealers have been taking days consulting Ford Hybrid Team on weird problems to make sure they get it right, then days longer to get major components away from assembly plant (some are in short supply).

Hope whatever it is also resolves your poor fuel economy problem.
-Dan

 

After reviewing manual, I think GaryG has pin-pointed likely problem...

Acceleration Control
The engine management system electronically operates the throttle of the engine in response to throttle pedal movements initiated by the driver. In the event of a system failure, the engine management system provides a "limp home" mode which allows the car to be driven with limited performance.

 

Ok, I'm relaying this second hand. (My girlfriend talked to the dealer.) But he told her the "throttle body is acting up." I have no idea what that means, but it sounds like it might be what you're talking about. They haven't tried to address the gas mileage or braking issues yet.

We asked for a loaner. They only have 4 loaner cars, so we're on the waiting list for one.

I've got to say, the Ford service certainly ain't the greatest. We also own a BMW, and the dealer will give you a loaner for anything - even if you need one for a few hours while they're changing the oil!

Anyway, hopefully this will solve at least one of the problems.

 

Gillman, I totally could be wrong according to what those yahoo's at the dealership will say. I've had an A/C activator valve replaced four times in three years in my 2002 Explorer. Something is causing that problem I would think. Other people should have the same problem if it is common. It's a knocking noise in the left rear area of the Exployer.

Anyway, I also look forward to copyboy's report from the dealer. It's good to know we have some people that want to help and find a cause of a problem. You are a good person in my book!

Gary

 

The symptoms sound drastic, but it could be something really simple. I'm not sure, but I think Lemon Laws vary state-by-state (although most states copy from each other, so laws tend to be remarkably similar). Here in Michigan if you have to take the car to service more than 3 times for the same problem, then you have a Lemon (under the law). The law puts some pressure on the dealer and manufacturer to get very comprehensive/complete in what they're willing to do as the car is returned for service more than once or twice.

I had a similar experience with my Audi A6. I'd go to pull out of my neighborhood onto the main road and the car wouldn't shift from 1st gear. It also had some other (seemingly unrelated) problems. In reverse the passenger-door rearview mirror is supposed to tip down 15deg so that I can see how close my tires are to the curb as I parallel park. The mirror would tip down, then never come up again when the car is in drive. Also, all 3 rear mirrors (passenger door, driver door, and interior rv mirror) auto-dim at night. The mirrors weren't dimming anymore. Turns out I read that the mirrors wont dim if they think the car is in reverse -- this is to let you have more visibility when you are backing up at night. I told the dealer about all these problems and said the only common component to all 3 propblems would be if the computer believed the car was supposed to be in reverse -- like a bad sensor on the tranmission selector.

Oh no... don't listen to the idiot customer because our mechanics are top-notch. Dealer wouldn't believe me and just kept trying to check the trasnmission for failures. On my third visit, they FINALLY ordered a new tranmission selector (this is the thing that knows if you're in P,R,N,D,etc.). Turns out it WAS a bad sensor. Though the trans was physically in "Drive" and would move forward, the computer thought it was "Reverse" and thus the problems with mirrors and accounting for the fact that it refused to shift (since it's electronically shifted transmission, the computer wouldn't shift it). But it was only the threat of the lemon law that forced the dealer to actually tear into that part to find the problem.

I had another brand new car where the turn signals kept freezing (wouldn't flash). The dealer kept replacing the flasher module. Turns out it was a loose wire on the back side of the fuse panel (where the flasher plugs in). The dealer didn't actually ever check the wiring - they figure "no flash", must be a broken flasher -- and would never do anything more. Again, after 3 visits, Lemon Law kicks in and they MUST fix successfully or buy back the car. This got them to spend 5 extra minutes unscrewing the fuse panel to check wires on the backside to find that the wire harness was barely plugged in. Never had another problem with that car again.

Good luck with your FEH. Hopefully they find/fix it and it turns out to be something really simple. I really love my FEH and fully intend to either buy another one -- or maybe that new Lexus GS hybrid (looks like a Prius, but luxury version) as long as fuel economy is as good as a Prius.

 

It does not sound like my Aux Coolant pump failure, but I was told that I should have gone into "safe mode," which sounds like what happened to you.

Instead of safe mode I got the FEH equivalant of the old windows BSOD.

 

So we just got the FEH back from the dealer today. They replaced the throttle body and claim that was the problem with both the major malfunction and with our poor gas mileage.

Could the throttle body really be at fault for our poor mpg? Does that make any sense?

And despite us telling them the car or the conditions have to be wet to replicate our brake problems, the dealer still says nothing's wrong with the brakes. "Well, did you wet the car's brakes down?" "Uh...no." My god these people drive me crazy.

 

So, the poor gas milage that didn't exist should be fixed by a defective throttle body that wasn't defective before but was once it threw a code? Hmmm.

A bad throttle body could cause poor mileage. Hopefully they solved the mileage problem (and the weirdness problem) and your first tank will reflect that. I'd probably change the oil just in case it had been running rich and contaminated the oil.

If your next tank shows a big improvement and you document all your fill-ups, I would send a strongly worded letter to the district/regional service manager and bring that to their attention. Sounds like they have/had some lazy techs that couldn't be bothered diagnosing a problem because they don't get much "flat-rate" time to do that......

Hope it works out and you become as impressed with your vehicle as most of us here are.

 

GOOD ADVICE!

Could a defective throttle body throw your fuel economy? Yes, and let me tell you why.

My brother had a car with a defective fuel injector. The injector basically stuck 'open' and just kept flooding the affected cylinder with fuel. His symptom was that he was getting poor fuel economy.

The cylinder burns what it can. Some of what it can't burn spew out the exhaut. Some of it will drain through the cylinders and into the oil pan. With the oil contaminated, your main bearings will get washed (read: insufficient lubricant because it's thinned with gasolilne) and end up burning out the bearings and siezing the engine. Not good. My brother siezed his engine and found his oil loaded with gas.

I'd change the oil (to be safe). If it really was the throttle body then the car should immediately start getting better fuel economy and your troubles should be behind you.

Good luck!

Regards,
Tim

 

From talking to two large Ford dealerships, each had only one certified FEH mechanic. As most of us know you can be a jack of all trades and master of none. Ford knows this and many times has the dealership just replace the whole unit and has them return the bad unit to detail what part failed or a needs a change in design. If they replaced the whole electronic thottle body with all sensors included as an assembly, It might take care of the problem. Please look on the paperwork you got with the repair and check all of the test or checked items with no charge they performed. That paperwork is important to keep and if you can give us a detail of what they did or didn't do, it will help. Many of us have the manuals the dealerships have which go step by step in diagnosis of a code or problem found.

For instanced, I was reading about finding a problem with the traction motor and the manual called for the whole trans. to be replaced in the FEH. In 1999 I had a oil consumption problem and Ford replaced the long block in my Navigator and had the dealer send it back to them for investigation.

I think the biggest thing that has come out is, you had and may still have a problem. Many of us that don't have the problem as most of the others with great MPG in the FEH, think it is the driver's habits, not the car. I never thought your problem was BS from the start. Your feedback is important to me and others here. Dan and others want to share problems as well as the benifits of the FEH. I have a great FEH and I know yours can be one also. It may take a good problem solver to get you there, but it's there. The FEH is not a lemon, it is the future that may have problems.

Tell us if things have improved or not this weekend.

Thanks, Gary