Well, bear in mind that that 93hp is the ICE only. The system's net output is 110HP, according to Honda's Site.

May I suggest you read this Road and Track Article. It's about hybrids, but they compare an EX with a hybrid. They give a 0-60 time of 8.9 seconds for the EX and 10.3 for the Hybrid--1.4 seconds (15%) slower. That gap gets worse as the needle climbs.

Also, the specs for that road test are here.

We dropped 16hp, but shed 275 pounds, so we really didn't notice a change in acceleration. But if you're that concerned with it, you'll probably never be satisfied with the HCH2. It's a pokey little puppy.

I am a Honda fan, but I really would recommend the Camry over the Accord. You'd be looking at mileage at least as good as the Civic EX, and more power than your old car. I'd at least troll the TCH section of this site. You may find someone in your area who can recommend a good salesman.

 

I think you have to make up your mind.

Are you someone who values power, or someone who values one of the greenest vehicles around.

You can't have both.

 

Yet.

There's no reason a hybrid could not be tuned to deliver both great mileage yet extremely good acceleration performance -- they key would be a larger elecrtic motor without upsizing the engine, or only upsizing the engine slightly (to accomodate exrta charging). The Accord hybrid (to cite an example) used a V6 mainly because that's the only engine Honda had at the time that could fit inside the engine bay, along with the motor. However, had they gone with a 1.8L 4-cylinder engine, and an elecrtic motor three times as powerful (perhaps powered by some ultracapacitors for suges of power, along with the battery), they could have achieved the same peak acceleration performance as the V6, but with the mileage of a 4-cylinder hybrid. Adding peak wattage on an elecrtic motor does not add resistance like adding engine displacement. (The disadvanatge of that method is that top speed will still be limited to whatever the smallish engine can produce)

Despite having less horsepower than the standard Civic, the CVT transmission helps a bit, and the elecrtic motors contribute significant torque across their entire range of RPMs, so not all horsepower ratings are equal. If they were to put out a 140hp Civic Hybrid (that would be quite nice, actually), it should accelerate faster than a 140hp gasoline Civic because of the high electric motor torque -- just as the Accord (240hp + 15hp elecrtic) saw a large jump in acceleration performance despite only gaining 15hp at the top end -- simply tuning the engine to put out 255hp would not have done as much.

 

Really cool article. Makes me realize how much more powerful the TCH really is. It would have cost me over 10 grand more than my trusty Civic. Not worth it to me. I would have gone for a 1.8L Civic first.

 

The HCH-II is a great commuter car. or for putzing about town.

It is NOT great with 300+ pounds of whatever extra riding around in it (Scuba gear, people, whatever). One adult, or two adults, even a small child or two is OK, but don't expect it to have any acceleration if you load it with more than that.

The Civic 1.8 will be a little better in handling the extra weight, but not outstanding at it either.
If you have to carry that much weight around often, I'd recommend the Camry Hybrid. Find a dealer outside your area if need be. You only buy it ONCE. You take it wherever you want (local dealer, e.g.) for service. Don't let bad local dealerships steer you away. I didn't. I flew 300 miles and drove my HCH-II back. And I'm glad I did!

 

I'm really sorry to hear this. I really like the look of the new HCH and MOST of the time I'll be driving it alone. But I want to have the option to use it for an occasional weekend getaway with my wife, and two teenage sons.

Thanks for your input.

Kelly

 

I drive a less powerful HCH I, and I don't see any major problems with the acceleration. It is no RX-7, but the torque, like others have said, will get it moving just fine. I get up to speed easily with little effort, get great mileage, does ok at interstate speeds, if you are a cautious driver and plan ahead, it has no problems providing transportation for you and your family.

I am a 'big' guy. I weigh about 270 lbs, I took a trip to TX with two friends, their weight combined about the same as I, plus luggage for 3; that is at least a 600 lb load, and I saw no problems. I wasn't speed racer, but efficiency and speed don't go well together.

I will admit, I desire a sports car to play around with on the weekends, but getting 40-60+ mpg is a whole lot better than 15-30 mpg, even at the sacrifice of a little grunt. I think the HCH II will fit your needs.

The Accord isn't going to get the mileage you are looking for, unless you use the hypermiling techniques (though still better than what you get now). The EX would be good, but remember the raw numbers are decieving ... 140 hp is nice but at what rpm? usable power is much more important. 140 hp at 6k is useless in a family car, unless you floor the pedal all the time.

the torque figure is more important in a daily driving situation. My best example is my old GrandVille, it must have weighed 2-3 tons with all that steel, big block, convertible ... It had a little more than 200 hp, but it had around 500 lb-ft of torque. It could get up to speed quickly and rarely passed 1800 rpms. I had to step on it to get to 2200, just because it had so much torque it could effortlessly get up to speed and shifted so early if I was light on the pedal I was in top gear before 20 mph.

The electric motor on the HCH can put out its max power pretty much from 0 rpm through normal rpm driving. I wish I had a link where you could compare the power. I had read a thread on another board comparing the RSX, Civic Si, and S2000 engines (very similar blocks). They all had the same basic power (and torque) curves and numbers, the S2000 had the most but it was close all the way up to the Si redline, then of course the S2k kept rising to its redline (with the RSX being comparable as well). If you knew how LITTLE power most vehicles make under 3k you would be amazed.

The best idea is to drive them all. Get a true feel for the cars. If you can't bring the wife and kids, ask the salesman to bring two buddies and then go for a ride, in each car. This way you know first hand what each feels like in your worst condition. If they know you are serious about buying a car, they should have no problem helping you out. Remember, different engines will never feel the same. My personal preferences are rotary engines and big blocks for power, a 6 cyl is just as weak as a 4 cyl IMHO.

Also there are some on here that have added high-flow air filters, high-flow catalytic converters, cat-back exhausts ... that would give you more acceleration with just a slight noise increase, and it doesn't seem to affect the mileage either. You can search for the thread. I think there is a similar thread on the Insight forum too.

Hope this helps some.

Personally, I am gonna trade-up to the HCH II, since I won't be able to buy a new Insight before they are discontinued, I will also be looking into a 88 CRX HF (great handling and mileage), a 93 FD3S RX-7 (a supercar in my eyes), and a 75 GrandVille 455 convertible (classic cruiser/showcar) as toys on the side.

 

I've probably abused my HCH-I more than anybody. With it's little 93 hp, I fly up mountains, peel out at lights occasionally...etc. It is perfectly capable of not getting you killed when merging on the freeway.

Americans are too obsessed with having more and more hp. We don't drive dragsters, we don't need more than 100 hp (unless towing stuff).

 

Great response. Thanks for taking the time to share your experience with me. Perhaps I'll do a little test driving tomorrow.

 

Best answer. Try it out.
Maybe you'll feel OK then using it with the occasional large load. I certainly don't mean to scare you away. Just trying to help you be happy with your purchase. And you might be happier with a Civic over say a Camry for 90-95% of the time (commuting), and "live with" its load-hauling shortcomings 5-10% of the time. The MPG difference is considerable - and the dollars will add up over time.

I know that my wife and I were concerned about the HCH-II's normal everyday abilities. Then, luckily, she got to drive one. I ordered one the next day! The hype over "hybrids have no guts" is a lot overdone, IMO.
Our other vehicles at the time (Jaguar XJ6, MB 560SL big V8, and Mazda Tribute V6) all accelerate very quickly and have enough power for most anybody, so we had been spoiled with power for quite some time, before making this transition. It's been much smoother than I anticipated.