In your signature it shows you own a 2004 Hond Civic hybrid. I own a 2001 honda Insight purchased in May of 2001. If anything it was people like me who TOOK THE CHANCE years ago who paved the way for people like you to buy your second gen hybrid vehicle. Im not speaking from ignorance, im speaking from experience so no offense taken

 

I was taking that into account. I think even the 1st Gen packs will drop, especially the 1st gen HCH and Prius - I know the '03-'05 production was somewhere at 70k+ for the HCH. As far as the Insight, production has been far less over the last 6 years but it's the technology IMO. I'm not saying all packs will be $900. Then again their always the possibilty of "rebuilt" packs. Old case, new innards - I honestly don't know enough about the technology to know if it's possible. It's a business someone (more than one) will sure enough capitolize on though. There's enough hybrids out there to make it a competitive busness, competition means lower prices.

 

I totaled my 2002 Prius in Jan.. I paid 23k for it back in Feb. 02, the insurance gave me $17.5k because I had a $1k deductable I didn't get $18.5k. I put just under 70k miles on the car, so if my math is correct I spent all most $7k to drive that car for 4 years so thats about 10 cents a mile.

I didn't figure in the oil changes, and I didn't have anything machanical go wrong.

I ordered an 06 Prius to replace the 02 should pick it up the last week of March.

 

I think Hondasucks provides a service. Sometimes this site is overly pro-hybrid and might get people's hopes up so high that they might be dissapointed. Of course I love my hybrid but that does not mean hybrids are for everyone. The battery issue is real in spite of the tendancy to gloss over it and point to the great IMA/HSD warranty. Perhaps new car buyers should not worry about such things but battery life is a concern for used car buyers.

People ask me what kind of mpg I get all the time. I tell em that I get 61mpg but that if they got a hybrid (Civic or Prius) and drove normally they would get mid to high forties. No since fostering unrealistic expections.

 

We need to be careful.

Depreciation is the expensing of a capital expense over time.
Thus, if two assets perform the same function, the one that costs more has more depreciation.

The REAL test, is the real world value of the resource when the depreciation is done.

The asset that costs more, should have a higher real world value at the end of the depreciation schedule. Yes?

Currently, used hyrids that are on the open market have a higher purchase cost than the cars they compete with, because the demand is so high for hybrids. While this is not a predictor of what will happen with our cars when our three, four and five year loan payments are ending, I content that our crystal ball is just as good as theirs.

The bottom line: there is a lot of specuating on the value of the car at the end of the payment schedule. IF YOU AREN'T going to SELL the car then, and run it until it becomes a maintenance headache, the depreciate argument is a non-issue.

 

There have been numerous hybrid reviews with lead-footed and uneducated writers that blame the hybrid for their bad driving. So far, the best way to evaluate hybrids is to ask on hybrid forums. Not everybody hypermiles, etc....the experiences have been largely positive.

I'm convinced that someone lurking for information would conclude hybrids are reliable and save money over the long term. The few bad experiences in many instances are like non-hybrid vehicles - lemons or misused cars.

In statistics and polling, the bigger sample - the more confident of your findings.

 

Depreciation for the classic model Prius has been similar to the most reliable and desired small cars. Edmunds, Kelly Blue Book, and NADA web sites provide the data. I also watch the ebay sales, which showed a novel "value spike" with the increase in gasoline prices late last year. Depreciation for the new model Prius has been approximately nil so far. I guess that it will start looking more like the classic, when the next model appears.

Fuel costs are less. How much less depends on what vehicle one compares. In any case it seems like a good hedge if fuel prices increase in the future.

All mechanical problems get closely examined, discussed, and effectively magnified in the internet groups, even though they seem to be few in number. Meanwhile the other, trouble-free hybrids just roll on. So it is hard to discern how the maint costs will stack up, but personally I would be very surprised if they do not turn out to be less than conventional cars, as a group.

However, with depreciation and fuel costs working in hybrids' favor, they will be financially competitive with conventional cars over quite a range of maintenance scenarios. If published articles come to different conclusions, I might wonder at their research, math skills, and motivtions, but will support freedom of expression.

DAS

 

To be fair the testers that are leadfoots were also leadfoots on other vehicles so the FE comparisons are accurate for what they are. Most drivers of hybrids and non are leadfoots relative to many here. I've only driven a HCH and I suspect lots of owners do have it to the floor all the time.

It could be enlightening to take drivers on this forum and test gas only vehicles for FE. I suspect we'd get much better than the reviewers. I'm atypical of Tacoma drivers, I beat EPA 22/27 handily.

 

What bugs me are the write-ups that say HCH gets mid 30's MPG by their professional drivers. It is easy to take that as face value by the unresearched and wonder if they could even get the crummy results as the article's paid drivers.
I'm not so sure.
Can anybody find anywhere in any printed publication anywhere that many people are getting 50's, 60's and even 70's MPG out of these machines?
If not, then why?
Why do they only print negative, and even make things up along the way?
(Low MPG, $7K batteries, $10K premium, false maintenance issues and whatever they can think of at the time.....like HV cables running through hybrid doors and roof that can electrocute rescue personnel)
If I were to see an article how some hybrid owners get electrocuted by worn plugin cables it wouldn't "shock" me.

The reward for good sensible driving is much greater in the hybrid.

The MPG spread is much wider for hybrid cars, at least for my HCH.
I could drive it hard and get low 30's, or stretch it out to almost 70MPG.
A 40MPG "spread" if you will.
Regarding our Grand Caravan I can drive it hard and get 15MPG or stretch it for about 28MPG.
A 13MPG spread.
Drive a Camry like a crazed person and get 19MPG.
Drive for economy and get 36MPG.
Drive a Prius with heavy foot and get 30.
Drive carefully and get 60's or even 70.

But don't expect to see that comparison in any magazine article.

The topic of Save Gas, Loose money isn't an issue in many of our cases.
To the lead footed person it very well be as the battery is more heavily used.
In cases like myself where we drive for efficiency it is used much less.
I hope to drive my HCH for +300K miles so surely the battery is a concern.
I just had my maintenance done and asked the dealer to analize and check my battery capacity. I was glad to know my battery measured at least 95%.

60,000 Miles with an excellent battery and no recals to date. Doing pretty good.

 

I know this is going off topic to the original post, But how did the dealer determin the battery capacity????? Because my batteries has been dieing for over a year and Honda COULD NOT diagnosis it, and there are alot of other insight owners who have the same problem. Lucky for me a few weeks ago the ima light went off. But the notion of being able to truley determin the capacity of the battery tweaks my interest